New Member Here - A few theories

[mizumi]

o.O

Long, talky posts making your head asplode?

yeah

[shinichi1977]

Since Kogoro Mouri is the most famous private detective in the area, regardless to which address the shirts were sent, there was a 50% percent probability that the person will ask him for help.

This is my scientist side objecting, but it is really silly to use numbers/percentages/probabilities like this without quantitative data to back it up. Unless you have an analysis of how fictional DC civilians choose which fictional local detective office to visit, 50% means nothing. I would stick purely qualitative words like "likely".

Active high-ranking members do not have day jobs much less publicity.

That's false. Vermouth was an actor and a high ranking member who was indeed conducting missions like luring out Akai dressed as a serial killer while in the public eye. Kir, also a codenamed agent, was specifically told to get into showbiz because it was convenient for them. Politician Domon's assassination plan relied on her newscaster job. Pisco was the president(?) of a car company; I don't think he was retired at the time but I have to check that info. In all three cases, they were all highly visible members of society. I would doubt Gin has a highly-visible day job because he directly meets with non-BO-member people for business and assassination who would know who he was pretty quickly if they saw him in daylight given his not-subtle appearance. That could change if Gin was decent as disguise -which he may be- but we don't know that yet.

Gin sucks at deduction, he only makes assumptions and acts on them even if they are false positives.

Definitely wrong. He does make some false assumptions which I can't blame him for since he doesn't expect adults to turn into children, nor does he expect that his primary opposition is a child as well, but don't forget his deduction in the locker room where he points out cold weather puts excessive strain on the sympathetic nervous system so someone with heart problems would never go to a rural house in the middle of the Gumna winter. He also recognized the purpose of the every trap Conan put on/in the CD case at a quick glance. Those were Shinichi level deductions there.

Vermouth really is good in disguises, but she is not an actress anymore.

She could go back to her role at anytime though. The things that are keeping her from doing so are the boss's request for her to remain at his side and her knowledge that Conan and the FBI know her identity at Chris Vineyard.

In the long history of DC, aside from a few exceptions, civilians hired Mouri based on locality, in Osaka everybody turns to Hattori Heiji, and other areas are covered by the introduced detectives in two long arcs, the one that was covered in ep. 219 and the other in ep. 479 (I lack the number of chapters, that's why I reference the episodes that covered them). My point was that although Mouri is quite well known, Aoyama narrows it down so as not to stray away with various locations instead of topics. And perhaps you aren't disagree with me on the subject that for some reason high valued members of the organization sniff out developing conflicts that lead up to criminal acts, and use the situation for their own gain.

Well, my memory might serve me wrong, when Sharon Vinyard was introduced, it was mentioned, that she is a film and stage actress, although was shown being in a play or film, even her former role was taken by someone younger, if she weren't a lot younger in reality, the main roles offered to her, would Sharon still be alive start with Electra, and not Juliet, or other supporting roles, which enables such an actress more free time. Anyhow, we did not see neither her nor Chris as active actresses but as famous people, Chris even stated taking a break (which coincided with the need for her to be just Vermouth). As for Pisco, at the age of over 70, Japanese social custom dictates in family and non-family companies alike to hold the honorary title, appoint a successor. Although in this regard, we have not seen that, so call that a hypothetical answer as to why he had much free time.

Gin is more intelligent than Vodka, that does not change the situation that he discards facts as he likes, since it happened in the very same locker room that he started to search for an adult in places only a child can fit in, and he judges material evidence on how it relates to his theory and not the other way around since he declared Mouri as an accomplice on mere circumstantial evidence, and let's not forget he had totally excluded the possibility that Sherry can be in Tokyo after they shot her on the roof of the Haido City Hotel.

Yes, Shinichi and the FBI knows who Chris Vinyard really is, but even without that knowledge she never intended to be in the spotlight, her secret makes a woman woman skit showed that she chose to remain in secrecy, so that would also mean a lot of question, and a funeral would not help her this time around.

[Chekhov MacGuffin]

In the long history of DC, aside from a few exceptions, civilians hired Mouri based on locality, in Osaka everybody turns to Hattori Heiji, and other areas are covered by the introduced detectives in two long arcs, the one that was covered in ep. 219 and the other in ep. 479 (I lack the number of chapters, that's why I reference the episodes that covered them). My point was that although Mouri is quite well known, Aoyama narrows it down so as not to stray away with various locations instead of topics.

It doesn't matter if Detective Mouri is the most famous detective in the area, people with issues don't have to necessarily visit a detective at all. They could go to the local police box or try to work it out themselves. Detectives are expensive after all and Kogoro did say at one point (508.9) he is only taking stalker and infidelity investigations. Also people with cases in Osaka probably don't go to Hattori Heiji as he has no formal detective agency and is still is high school. Heiii's father would likely find it inappropriate. Heiji seems to work on cases he runs across or tags after the police like Shinichi did. There is almost certainly selection bias. Since Kogoro and Heiji are major characters, we are going to see their cases rather than those of other detectives. In fact, the gathered detectives case implies that there are plenty of other well known detectives out there.

And perhaps you aren't disagree with me on the subject that for some reason high valued members of the organization sniff out developing conflicts that lead up to criminal acts, and use the situation for their own gain.

I'm not sure what you are saying here. The B.O. has made use of criminals like when Vermouth disguised as a serial killer to lure out Akai in NY and kept the real one stuffed away somewhere as the fall guy. If you are talking about how scar Akai showed up and then crimes occurred, I think it is simply bad luck on his part. Scar Akai would not have wanted to get stuck in the bank with Jodie where his identity may be revealed if his mask is damaged or the police stop him, or something like that. Also if scar Akai knew about the Baker dept. store crime beforehand, his deduction would have probably mentioned the backstory of the crime in the snowy mountains on dec 29.

Well, my memory might serve me wrong, when Sharon Vinyard was introduced, it was mentioned, that she is a film and stage actress, although was shown being in a play or film, even her former role was taken by someone younger, if she weren't a lot younger in reality, the main roles offered to her, would Sharon still be alive start with Electra, and not Juliet, or other supporting roles, which enables such an actress more free time. Anyhow, we did not see neither her nor Chris as active actresses but as famous people, Chris even stated taking a break (which coincided with the need for her to be just Vermouth). ... Yes, Shinichi and the FBI knows who Chris Vinyard really is, but even without that knowledge she never intended to be in the spotlight, her secret makes a woman woman skit showed that she chose to remain in secrecy, so that would also mean a lot of question, and a funeral would not help her this time around.

I'm pretty sure your memory is wrong. Sharon Vineyard was considered a very famous actress and she couldn't have achieved that level of popularity in Hollywood unless she took a main lead. As Sharon, she got an Oscar,and Akai specifically mentioned her bathing in the limelight of the stage. Sharon Vineyard seems to be more popular than Chris Vineyard, but Vermouth's Chris role became a famous actress too. Even if we don't see Vermouth acting during the flashback doesn't mean she isn't acting. And Vermouth definitely intended to become a highly popular actor as both Sharon and Chris: you don't become a famous Hollywood idol without intending to be one. It isn't logical to extrapolate the "secret makes a woman, woman" line of hers into some sort of pronouncement that she never intended to become famous as an actor.

As for Pisco, at the age of over 70, Japanese social custom dictates in family and non-family companies alike to hold the honorary title, appoint a successor. Although in this regard, we have not seen that, so call that a hypothetical answer as to why he had much free time.

I'd like to see a citation for that. Masuyama Kenzou's suspect profile box would have said retired if he was retired.

Abs. says

He was a 会長 - a chairman. Still very much a person of influence.

Gin is more intelligent than Vodka, that does not change the situation that he discards facts as he likes, since it happened in the very same locker room that he started to search for an adult in places only a child can fit in, and he judges material evidence on how it relates to his theory and not the other way around since he declared Mouri as an accomplice on mere circumstantial evidence, and let's not forget he had totally excluded the possibility that Sherry can be in Tokyo after they shot her on the roof of the Haido City Hotel.

Gin did ignore the possibility of a child being in the locker, but think about it, who would expect an elementary school kid to be the brains behind something like that? Gin has good "instincts" in addition to his deductive skill; he was correct about someone being in the lockers. Gin had a damn good reason for thinking Mouri was involved with Sherry: the same gum+wiretap combo was used on him before the Pisco case and he thought for sure the planter in that case was Sherry because of her hair. He was also correct about Mouri being the only person who would have been able to plant the tracker without Kir noticing; except it wasn't Mouri, it was Conan who was with him at the same time. Logically, one suspects the adults rather than the kids. In effect, Gin's deductions would have been spot on if it wasn't for the fact a kid was the real mastermind. Finally, Gin wasn't stupid in excluding the Tokyo area in his search; he was predicting Sherry's next move based on her personality. As he predicted, Sherry said she was going to flee the area (242.16&17). It was Shinichi's reverse psychology that Gin can't take into account because he doesn't know what kind of person Shinichi is.

[Abs.]

As for Pisco, at the age of over 70, Japanese social custom dictates in family and non-family companies alike to hold the honorary title, appoint a successor. Although in this regard, we have not seen that, so call that a hypothetical answer as to why he had much free time.

I'd like to see a citation for that. Masuyama Kenzou's suspect profile box would have said retired if he was retired.

He was a 会長 - a chairman.  Still very much a person of influence.

[soratothamax]

Hi!  I'm acerola21, and I just joined this forum. ^^  I really just wanted to share a few of my theories I came up with while I was re-reading the B.O. chapters . . . I'm not sure how much you guys know already, so some of the theories might be redundant, but I still hope that you guys will enjoy it.

1. Anokata = Elena Miyano (Shiho/Ai's mom)

This sounds crazy, I know, but I'm 90% sure right now that Anokata is Elena, or at least someone related to her.  Remember that her nickname is "Hell Angel" (File 424 p. 12) - this reminds me of what the lady said on the phone to Itakura: "We can be both of God and the devil.  Since we are trying to raise the dead against the stream of time" (File 380 p.13).  The B.O. is both God and the devil - and Elena is called Hell Angel.  Also remember that the lady who said this line has a cat with her (File 398 p.5) - therefore, the lady can't be Vermouth, since she was disguising as Araide during this time, and Araide doesn't have cats (Files 234-237).  If it's not Vermouth, it must be another lady who is fluent in English and Japanese - and that includes Elena, who is British and is fluent in Japanese.

Also, Elena's tapes for Haibara are strange.  They are numbered #1-20, and each one seems to correspond to Haibara's birthday, since Conan listened to the #11-15 tape and it had Elena talk to 11-year-old Haibara at the beginning (File 425 p. 17).  If Elena prepared these tapes right before she was about to be killed by the B.O., why would she prepare so many, instead of just one?  And why should she prepare a tape for each of her daughter's birthday in such a short amount of time?  My guess is that Elena prepared these tapes each year after her daughter was born, and continued to record the tapes until Shiho disappeared and became Ai - which may mean that Elena is still alive.  Also, Haibara hears something strange from the end of the tape that talks to 18-year-old Haibara (File 427 p.9):

Spoiler:

Elena thinks that Haibara is old enough to hear that she is - what?  Strangely enough, after this file, Haibara seems to know who Anokata is:  She recognizes Kurayashi, Tottori before Conan figures out that Anokata's phone number has the area's numbers (File 466 p.6), and when Conan does figure out the phone number contemplates about having Takagi call it, Haibara mentions that the police would end up catching some "unbelievable characters," and Conan himself starts doubting if Haibara knew Anokata's phone number and his/her identity after all (File 475 p.5).

In addition, remember that Pisco has served Anokata for a long time - and remember that he was also long-time friends with the Miyano's (File 242 p.9).  So who did Pisco serve?  Pisco could have served the Miyano's, specifically, Elena.  Also remember that Gosho says that he knows what he wants to do with the ending, and that he almost always give the readers enough clues to figure out the mysteries for themselves.

So why do I think that Elena is Anokata and not Atsushi?  Because of the discrepancy in the way Akemi and Shiho were treated.  Shiho seems to have studied abroad as soon as she was born, while Akemi remained in Japan and lead an almost normal life; Shiho is near the very top of the B.O., while Akemi is near the very bottom; and Shiho and Akemi look nothing alike.  Why is there such a discrepancy?  My guess is that this is because Shiho and Akemi are actually half-sisters; Akemi must be Atushi's previous wife's, while Shiho is Elena's.  This may be why Elena leaves Akemi almost alone while Shiho gets all the special treatment.

I'm not 100% sure about this, but all the evidence seems to point that Elena is Anokata, or at least related to him/her somehow, at least to me.  Still, I don't think that she's a bad person, based on the fact that Vermouth doesn't seem entirely like a bad person.  I have some ideas about why Elena wants Sherry dead, but they are pure speculation and I can't pull any evidence from the series.

2. Bourbon = Okiya

This is another crazy one, I know - and unlike my previous theory, I'm only about 80% sure about it.  I thought that Bourbon = Scar!Akai and Okiya = Akai for the longest time, but I thought that it was too easy - the plot is almost identical to Jodie not being Vermouth and Eisuke not being Kir.  I don't think that Gosho would use such a plot for the third time.

The major reason why I don't think that Okiya is Akai is from these scenes, from File 419:

Spoiler:

The one with glasses is the one who followed Haibara during Files 417-419, and as you can see, he contacts Akai about not being able to follow Haibara anymore, meaning that he is not Akai in disguise - he is a different person from Akai.  And even though we have been introduced to members of the FBI in the Mizunashi Rena chapters, we have never seen any characters with glasses on them, or a lady with a hat (she rides on the passenger side - see File 419 p.6 - I say that the person is a she because of the way the lips are drawn) - this could mean that those two work outside of the FBI, for Akai.  Jodie also mentions how Akai "found conclusive evidence that Ethan Hondou is a CIA agent," even though she doesn't know how Akai got that evidence (File 595 p.11).  Since the only other ones aside from the CIA who know that Hondou is a CIA agent is most likely the B.O., and since Akai had to ask Rena to sneak back into the B.O. and therefore is unlikely to have any ties to the CIA, Akai could have found out through inside information - specifically, through the glasses guy and the hat lady.  That would explain how Akai knew that Hondou was a CIA agent just by looking at the picture.  Akai may also have leaked some information to the B.O. - in File 607 p.4, someone leaked information about how Camel became a suspect in a murder case, even though the only ones who were shown to know about it were Jodie, James, and Akai himself (File 606 p.8).  Since Jodie was busy taking care of Camel, she can't have leaked the information, and James has no motive - Akai is the likely suspect, perhaps casually telling the glasses guy or the hat lady about the incident over the phone.

I think that you know where I'm going with this - I think that Akai somehow converted Bourbon (who is most likely the glasses guy who is most likely Okiya) and the hat lady during his stay in the B.O., and those two are continuing to work for Akai.

Also, if Akai is Okiya, why would Okiya say that his favorite color is black because it hides facts about himself while he hates it for the same reason (File 623 p.7)?  Why would Akai, who we know is a good person, want to hide anything about himself?  It would make sense if Okiya is Bourbon and Akai converted Bourbon - that way, it would be no surprise if Okiya wants to hide facts about himself.

Okiya/Bourbon is also most likely the one who protected Scar!Akai from being shot by Chianti.  Gin does not order Chianti to shoot, not because he doesn't think that Scar!Akai is Akai - when he sees Scar!Akai, he thinks, "Akai Shuuichi" (File 704 p.10) - but because Vermouth tells him to, with permission of Anokata (File 704 p.11).  After this, Gin complains about the "bastard" "doing as he pleases" (File 704 p.13), and then mentions how he wishes that detectives like Sherlock Holmes would stay fictional (File 704 p.14) - therefore, stopping the shooting most likely has something to do with Bourbon, since Bourbon, like Vermouth, is "secretive" (File 703 p.3) and therefore "does as he pleases," and since Gin mentions Sherlock Holmes, which means that he can't mean Vermouth but Bourbon instead.  Therefore, Bourbon must have known about the plan to shoot Scar!Akai - and we know that Okiya was in the department store, and he saw Gin and Chianti (File 703 p.4) and Scar!Akai (File 702 p.16), and therefore knew about the planned shooting.  Bourbon/Okiya isn't the only one who attempted to save Scar!Akai - Conan did as well, and why would he do this if Scar!Akai is Bourbon?  Also, Okiya criticizes Conan on how he tried to save Scar!Akai, saying that the customers' criticism will be even higher now (File 704 p.15), and it makes no sense for Okiya to criticize Conan unless Okiya tried to save Scar!Akai himself.

So why does Conan recognize Okiya's address?  Remember that Conan had Takagi stall glasses guy and hat lady by having him inspect if they were drunk driving or not (File 419 p.18 - the translation here is bad but I checked the original Japanese and that's what it says - yes I know Japanese, I lived in Japan for eight years), so Conan could have known Okiya's address from asking Takagi about the drivers.  And this may also be why he trusted Okiya from the beginning, since he thought that Okiya is the FBI who trailed Haibara, though now he seems to realize that he is wrong, based on how he reacted in File 704 p.16.

Therefore, Okiya must be Bourbon, and though I have some doubts, Scar!Akai must be Akai, although it makes no sense to me why Akai would show his plain face in public and risk Rena's life, cutting off potential information he could gain from the CIA.

Ha ha, that turned out way too long.  Can you tell that I've been dying to share my theories? X3

EDIT:  Man I messed up the links - they should be fixed, now.

Hey I agree with you about one thing: I do still feel Haibara's mother and/or father is still alive. Her mother might be a higher member and she might be in disguise....

Your theories about her mother being "that person" are influential. But I see this one flaw: Haibara's dad would constantly stare out the window. That tells me he was in fear of someone OUTSIDE of the house. Elena would be with him when he would stare outside of the house. So it appears that it is someone else he fears that was not with him. Elena probably told Haibara who "that person" is. Also, Conan concluded that she was a "Real Angel" so that means what he heard contradicted the theory that she could be running this evil operation. Also, there was a car stationed outside, so someone was watching them. I think if they DID die, however, they were "killed", and there was no "accident." I feel that Elena got her husband in the in the BO, and probably helped sponsor Atsushi's theory...

Also, I do see Akemi having a different mother. Elena and Atsushi had moved to a facility, Ai lived in a facility, so who was Akemi living with to be "living a normal life"?

I also don't think Okiya is Akai. To me, that is absurd. The only one who dressed up as anyone else was Ai and Vermouth, and based on Kaito Kid series she had been taught by Kid's father to use different disguises. She is also an actress who dresses up as people all the time. Akai has no experience with that. At best, the FBI just changes their clothes, put on a different hat, or wears shades (sunglasses).

I personally  think if she isn't the BO boss,  we don't know who "that person" is yet and I think we have a long time until we find out...

Another thing that gets me is this....Vermouth already knows Sherry's idenitity is Ai Haibara....so why hasn't she said anything to Gin? And also, why is Sherry trying to hide it still? Ai knows Vermouth discovered her identity, so why is she still trying to hold off on not telling, or trying to convince conan not to tell Ran?

Edit: If Elena was the head of the BO, she could've been killed by Gin, and Gin could be hiding it from everyone. that's why he wants to kill Sherry so bad because he knows that she has the closest chance of finding out....or he might be trying to kill her because she is supposed to inherit the BO...Gin could be taking things into his own hands and hiding from lower members. He knows how to be sneaky with this kind of thing with his clever mind, doesn't follow rules, and has the status to keep it hidden. He would know if he's having contact with that person or not, so it can work. but who knows....

[Abs.]

Elena probably told Haibara who "that person" is. Also, Conan concluded that she was a "Real Angel"

That reminds me...  There's only one person that has been referred to as an angel so far in the series......................... 

[acerola21]

Your theories about her mother being "that person" are influential. But I see this one flaw: Haibara's dad would constantly stare out the window. That tells me he was in fear of someone OUTSIDE of the house. Elena would be with him when he would stare outside of the house. So it appears that it is someone else he fears that was not with him. Elena probably told Haibara who "that person" is. Also, Conan concluded that she was a "Real Angel" so that means what he heard contradicted the theory that she could be running this evil operation. Also, there was a car stationed outside, so someone was watching them. I think if they DID die, however, they were "killed", and there was no "accident." I feel that Elena got her husband in the in the BO, and probably helped sponsor Atsushi's theory...

Yeah, I have plenty of flaws in my theory.  I'm not sure why Atsushi was constantly looking out the window, either, nor do I know why there was always a car outside, or what the B.O. (I assume) did when they broke into the architect's house two times after the adult Akemi dropped by.  Also, apparently Haibara's parents did continue the research and not start it (stupid anime changing manga canon!), so the possibility of Elena being "anokata" went down quite a bit when I found that out. ^^;

I do realize one thing when I re-read some chapters in Japanese, though - apparently, when Gosho said "Hell Angel" he meant 地ç

[Kor]

I also don't think Okiya is Akai. To me, that is absurd. The only one who dressed up as anyone else was Ai and Vermouth, and based on Kaito Kid series she had been taught by Kid's father to use different disguises. She is also an actress who dresses up as people all the time. Akai has no experience with that. At best, the FBI just changes their clothes, put on a different hat, or wears shades (sunglasses).

You're way off. Here is a list of numerous people who disguised as someone else (aside from those you pointed out):
Conan, Heiji, Yukiku, Sato, the whole sherade in the red wall case...
Gosho has used the disguise concept way too many times. EVERYONE apparently can put a disguise in DC, and since Gosho is so repetitive, I think it's very likely that Okiya is Akai.

[soratothamax]

I also don't think Okiya is Akai. To me, that is absurd. The only one who dressed up as anyone else was Ai and Vermouth, and based on Kaito Kid series she had been taught by Kid's father to use different disguises. She is also an actress who dresses up as people all the time. Akai has no experience with that. At best, the FBI just changes their clothes, put on a different hat, or wears shades (sunglasses).

You're way off. Here is a list of numerous people who disguised as someone else (aside from those you pointed out):
Conan, Heiji, Yukiku, Sato, the whole sherade in the red wall case...
Gosho has used the disguise concept way too many times. EVERYONE apparently can put a disguise in DC, and since Gosho is so repetitive, I think it's very likely that Okiya is Akai.

Sato was not a totally different person. She put on shades, and a hat. So did Takagi, who put on a wig. But neither wore facial masks, as in different skin tones, different faces, etc.

yukiko is an actress, did i not just stress that point? The red wall case, they also didn't go as far as to have completely different faces. The only one who had a TOTALLY DIFFERENT FACE was Vermouth. Ai only covered her face, but kept the same face, so Ai doesn't count either.

I think Okiya is part of the CIA with Rena Mizunashi. If not, he is an executive member. But I don't think he is Akai. I feel it is obsurd that he looks TOTALLY different. Other people in disguises, still had the same face, similar body structure, or similar hair to their regular selves.

[soratothamax]

When someone can't use his or her leading hand it might change of course, like for example an injured or broken shoulder blade and it won't change back, this case is not like one, since we had seen that Scar Akai is burnt on his right cheek, indicating that either real or fake that person was not injured on his dominant side. He could not lose his dominant hand to a brain injury either since as mentioned, he would have lost the capability of learning too and being impaired of that, he could not use a gun, let alone get directions, etc.

It's quite funny how you mention the scar, because I've seen this page (see bottom right panel) and realized that the Akai-looking-dude doesn't have a scar on his right cheek at that moment.  Maybe Gosho forgot to draw it in, or something, but it bothers me.  I haven't seen the anime version - maybe it's drawn in there - but I usually follow the manga for canon references.

Also, since the lady at the Beika department store couldn't remember a man with a scar on his cheek buying the special-made hat only sold in Beika department store, I'm guessing that the Akai-looking-dude didn't have a scar when he bought the hat.  If he's Bourbon and Gosho forgot to draw the scar, that means that Scar(?)Akai Bourbon lived in the Beika area before Kir says he started moving, and he must have lived in Beika for a while, since Akai was in the US ~1 year ago, and was in Japan to infiltrate the B.O. five to two years ago.  If Bourbon hates Akai because the burn was caused by Akai, then that means that Bourbon must have gotten the burn (if it's real) between 5 to 2 years ago, and if Bourbon bought the hat before he got the burn, it means that he must have lived in Beika for two years, at the very least.

But then, Rena said that Bourbon started moving recently (and right after Akai is thought to be dead, too - Rena and Jodie seem to think that Bourbon's target is Sherry, but I have a sneaking suspicion that his real target is to investigate if Akai is really dead or not, since apparently he thinks that only he can kill Akai) - so that doesn't give the impression that Bourbon lived in Beika for a while.  Besides, like I said Rena told Gin that she quit being a newscaster - so I don't think that she plans on staying in the B.O. for long.  She's helpful to the B.O. because she's a newscaster - she can help the B.O. assassinate people by using her position, so I don't see why she would tell Gin that she just quit being a newscaster because the move would arouse suspicions, especially to Gin.  Maybe Scar(?)Akai is just Akai and and he's using himself to fish out the B.O., I dunno. *shrug*

Also, it's fully possible that Akai is ambidextrous.  Lots of left-handed people end up having to be somewhat ambidextrous, since this world is essentially made for right-handed people and whatnot - and I'm sure you guys know, since you guys apparently discussed it at length already.

There's also the possibility that Gosho didn't forget to draw in the scar, and the scar is fake.  This would mean that Scar(?)Akai got the fake scar in the short time span between when Jodie saw him on the streets and when she saw him in the bank . . . and maybe he's really Bourbon and Vermouth helped him disguise his scar, I'm not sure.

Anyways, I'm essentially saying that I can adequately explain both the Okiya = Akai & Scar(?)Akai = Bourbon and the Okiya = Bourbon & Scar(?)Akai = Akai theories at this point, and I see no conclusive evidence that says either one is right and the other wrong - from the manga, anyways.  The biggest supporting evidence for the Okiya = Akai theory would be the Char Aznable references, I think, but maybe Gosho's screwing with us - I have no idea.  There's also the possibility that Scar(?)Akai is a third party person who is neither Akai nor Bourbon, of course, and same for Okiya.

The side we are looking at from our angle is actually the LEFT side of his face. Under the umbrella, hidden by hair, it seems to be there. It is slightly hidden, but the scar is there.

[acerola21]

I also don't think Okiya is Akai. To me, that is absurd. The only one who dressed up as anyone else was Ai and Vermouth, and based on Kaito Kid series she had been taught by Kid's father to use different disguises. She is also an actress who dresses up as people all the time. Akai has no experience with that. At best, the FBI just changes their clothes, put on a different hat, or wears shades (sunglasses).

You're way off. Here is a list of numerous people who disguised as someone else (aside from those you pointed out):
Conan, Heiji, Yukiku, Sato, the whole sherade in the red wall case...
Gosho has used the disguise concept way too many times. EVERYONE apparently can put a disguise in DC, and since Gosho is so repetitive, I think it's very likely that Okiya is Akai.

Sato was not a totally different person. She put on shades, and a hat. So did Takagi, who put on a wig. But neither wore facial masks, as in different skin tones, different faces, etc.

yukiko is an actress, did i not just stress that point? The red wall case, they also didn't go as far as to have completely different faces. The only one who had a TOTALLY DIFFERENT FACE was Vermouth. Ai only covered her face, but kept the same face, so Ai doesn't count either.

I think Okiya is part of the CIA with Rena Mizunashi. If not, he is an executive member. But I don't think he is Akai. I feel it is obsurd that he looks TOTALLY different. Other people in disguises, still had the same face, similar body structure, or similar hair to their regular selves.

To be fair to the Okiya=Akai people, I don't think that Akai and Okiya's faces look too different - they have the same body type, same face shape, etc.  I do think that they have different personalities and that Akai isn't such a dedicated actor as to bother to water plants every morning (along with other evidences that make me doubt that Okiya is Akai), but I'm sure that Akai can pull off a simple disguise by putting on a wig/dying his hair and putting on glasses.

See here:

Spoiler:

I mean, a fact is a fact, right?  It's hard to dispute that Akai and Okiya have similar body type and face structure.  However, they do seem to have different personalities (I mean, Okiya cooks well and he's good with children and, once again, he waters plants every morning), and I'm saying that you can't change your personality unless you have extensive showbiz background in DC . . . but I do admit that Akai would probably be capable of disguising outwardly as Okiya if he tried.

The side we are looking at from our angle is actually the LEFT side of his face. Under the umbrella, hidden by hair, it seems to be there. It is slightly hidden, but the scar is there.

You mean from the front?  You mean this panel, right?

Spoiler:

Anyways, as I've said it's hard to tell if ScarAkai has his scar at that point or not, since Gosho keeps changing the position of the scar in that chapter.

[Chekhov MacGuffin]

I think Okiya is part of the CIA with Rena Mizunashi. If not, he is an executive member. But I don't think he is Akai. I feel it is obsurd that he looks TOTALLY different. Other people in disguises, still had the same face, similar body structure, or similar hair to their regular selves.

Spoiler:

A wig or a hair straightening session + dye and a pair of out of prescription glasses would suffice.

I mean, a fact is a fact, right?  It's hard to dispute that Akai and Okiya have similar body type and face structure.  However, they do seem to have different personalities (I mean, Okiya cooks well and he's good with children and, once again, he waters plants every morning), and I'm saying that you can't change your personality unless you have extensive showbiz background in DC . . . but I do admit that Akai would probably be capable of disguising outwardly as Okiya if he tried.

People without extensive showbiz background who did fine in acting include: Kudo Yuusaku during the Conan's kidnapping case, Hidemi Hondou hid her true personality from the B.O., arguably Haibara at times who hides her real feelings, Sumiko Kobayashi was stern at first, but didn't drop her act publicly until the school case, Hattori Heizo in the tiger scroll case tricks the culprit and manipulates his son, Akemi Miyano to fool Mouri (it wasn't her personality that dropped, it was her makeup that tipped off Conan), and a metric bloody ton of case culprits.

[soratothamax]

I think Okiya is part of the CIA with Rena Mizunashi. If not, he is an executive member. But I don't think he is Akai. I feel it is obsurd that he looks TOTALLY different. Other people in disguises, still had the same face, similar body structure, or similar hair to their regular selves.

Spoiler:

A wig or a hair straightening session + dye and a pair of out of prescription glasses would suffice.

I mean, a fact is a fact, right?  It's hard to dispute that Akai and Okiya have similar body type and face structure.  However, they do seem to have different personalities (I mean, Okiya cooks well and he's good with children and, once again, he waters plants every morning), and I'm saying that you can't change your personality unless you have extensive showbiz background in DC . . . but I do admit that Akai would probably be capable of disguising outwardly as Okiya if he tried.

People without extensive showbiz background who did fine in acting include: Kudo Yuusaku during the Conan's kidnapping case, Hidemi Hondou hid her true personality from the B.O., arguably Haibara at times who hides her real feelings, Sumiko Kobayashi was stern at first, but didn't drop her act publicly until the school case, Hattori Heizo in the tiger scroll case tricks the culprit and manipulates his son, Akemi Miyano to fool Mouri (it wasn't her personality that dropped, it was her makeup that tipped off Conan), and a metric bloody ton of case culprits.

If they were prescription glasses, he would squint often and not be able to see....Akai never wore glasses...unless he wore contacts we don't know about...If he were to wear prescriptioned glasses, he would have to be able to see out of them, and conan would notice that. You can tell when glasses are prescription or not.

Now, they might not be prescription glasses, they could be fake, and conan noticed they were. And so noticed he was someone familiar....

However, I don't see the resemblance between Akai or Okiya. They are not similar in many ways either. I feel that Okiya is part of CIA.

[soratothamax]

I also don't think Okiya is Akai. To me, that is absurd. The only one who dressed up as anyone else was Ai and Vermouth, and based on Kaito Kid series she had been taught by Kid's father to use different disguises. She is also an actress who dresses up as people all the time. Akai has no experience with that. At best, the FBI just changes their clothes, put on a different hat, or wears shades (sunglasses).

You're way off. Here is a list of numerous people who disguised as someone else (aside from those you pointed out):
Conan, Heiji, Yukiku, Sato, the whole sherade in the red wall case...
Gosho has used the disguise concept way too many times. EVERYONE apparently can put a disguise in DC, and since Gosho is so repetitive, I think it's very likely that Okiya is Akai.

Sato was not a totally different person. She put on shades, and a hat. So did Takagi, who put on a wig. But neither wore facial masks, as in different skin tones, different faces, etc.

yukiko is an actress, did i not just stress that point? The red wall case, they also didn't go as far as to have completely different faces. The only one who had a TOTALLY DIFFERENT FACE was Vermouth. Ai only covered her face, but kept the same face, so Ai doesn't count either.

I think Okiya is part of the CIA with Rena Mizunashi. If not, he is an executive member. But I don't think he is Akai. I feel it is obsurd that he looks TOTALLY different. Other people in disguises, still had the same face, similar body structure, or similar hair to their regular selves.

To be fair to the Okiya=Akai people, I don't think that Akai and Okiya's faces look too different - they have the same body type, same face shape, etc.  I do think that they have different personalities and that Akai isn't such a dedicated actor as to bother to water plants every morning (along with other evidences that make me doubt that Okiya is Akai), but I'm sure that Akai can pull off a simple disguise by putting on a wig/dying his hair and putting on glasses.

See here:

Spoiler:

I mean, a fact is a fact, right?  It's hard to dispute that Akai and Okiya have similar body type and face structure.  However, they do seem to have different personalities (I mean, Okiya cooks well and he's good with children and, once again, he waters plants every morning), and I'm saying that you can't change your personality unless you have extensive showbiz background in DC . . . but I do admit that Akai would probably be capable of disguising outwardly as Okiya if he tried.

The side we are looking at from our angle is actually the LEFT side of his face. Under the umbrella, hidden by hair, it seems to be there. It is slightly hidden, but the scar is there.

You mean from the front?  You mean this panel, right?

Spoiler:

Anyways, as I've said it's hard to tell if ScarAkai has his scar at that point or not, since Gosho keeps changing the position of the scar in that chapter.

yea that's his right cheek that has the scar.

BTW Okiya and Akai don't have the same body shape to me. They are both well-built, but does that mean every grown muscular man that shows up is automatically the same guy? Kaito Kid and Shinichi are built the same, but still aren't the same. Gosho seems to make relations in built or demeanor in reference to how similar they are yes, but I believe it is because of the fact that they are both very good at deducing. I feel Okiya is assigned to kill Akai....but won't because he's part of the CIA.

[Chekhov MacGuffin]

If they were prescription glasses, he would squint often and not be able to see....Akai never wore glasses...unless he wore contacts we don't know about...If he were to wear prescriptioned glasses, he would have to be able to see out of them, and conan would notice that. You can tell when glasses are prescription or not.
Now, they might not be prescription glasses, they could be fake, and conan noticed they were. And so noticed he was someone familiar....
However, I don't see the resemblance between Akai or Okiya. They are not similar in many ways either. I feel that Okiya is part of CIA.

I linked the Boar, Deer, Butterfly Scroll case for a reason. Genta's dad wore prescription glasses when he didn't have to forcing him to squint to see clearly. It conjures an obvious parallel to someone else wearing glasses...