Mafia! Mafia! Mafia! Character Role Discussions

[pofa]

This was Akonyl's idea from IRC re: "Give Anokata a Purpose."

Blackmail (Night/Day action), can be used once per two phases

-Anokata can choose to "blackmail" a town player into taking a certain action on another player in the game. For example, he may PM the GM with the order, "Discombobulate Yurikochan" and a random town player with the ability "discombobulate," if one exists, will be forced to use his or her action on Yurikochan that night. Similarly, could PM the GM with the order, "Follow Yurikochan" during the day, and Haibara or Kazuha will be forced to follow Yurikochan instead of their intended target.
-Limited successful uses? This could get quite powerful, so we'd need a way to avoid Anokata constantly trolling the protectors, etc. Make it similar to Calvados's ability, in that Anokata can only blackmail each "type" of action once per game?

-

Also, suggested replacements for Spy/Deduct, because those moves are no fun D:

-Move Pry from Gin to Bourbon, so he has detect and pry, as the mafia detective :V
-Give Yusaku Analyze, but make him choose between "interrogate" and "analyze" each night.
-Give Okiya something similar to Uehara's ID, where he can ID someone as a role he has detected previously, OR, give him the option to Detect x2 in return for coming up "BO" in interrogation that night.

Also, we're trying to think of more options for Agasa to make him not quite so boring to play. Someone suggested:

Kick Shoes, Day Action
-Agasa may choose to give out his "kick shoes." These have no function (unless we want them to have one), but Agasa gets them back the next day and gets to know whether or not they "fit," that is, whether the recipient is a child or not. So a way for Agasa to potentially find allies. It was also suggested that if the recipient is a child, he/she could use them as a discombobulation device that night.
-Agasa can only give out two items per day, so he has to choose between the shoes, bowtie, and watch.

-

Thoughts? (I was just gonna give Anokata detain, but :x)

[PT]

This was Akonyl's idea from IRC re: "Give Anokata a Purpose."

Blackmail (Night/Day action), can be used once per two phases

-Anokata can choose to "blackmail" a town player into taking a certain action on another player in the game. For example, he may PM the GM with the order, "Discombobulate Yurikochan" and a random town player with the ability "discombobulate," if one exists, will be forced to use his or her action on Yurikochan that night. Similarly, could PM the GM with the order, "Follow Yurikochan" during the day, and Haibara or Kazuha will be forced to follow Yurikochan instead of their intended target.
-Limited successful uses? This could get quite powerful, so we'd need a way to avoid Anokata constantly trolling the protectors, etc. Make it similar to Calvados's ability, in that Anokata can only blackmail each "type" of action once per game?

-

Also, suggested replacements for Spy/Deduct, because those moves are no fun D:

-Move Pry from Gin to Bourbon, so he has detect and pry, as the mafia detective :V
-Give Yusaku Analyze, but make him choose between "interrogate" and "analyze" each night.
-Give Okiya something similar to Uehara's ID, where he can ID someone as a role he has detected previously, OR, give him the option to Detect x2 in return for coming up "BO" in interrogation that night.

Also, we're trying to think of more options for Agasa to make him not quite so boring to play. Someone suggested:

Kick Shoes, Day Action
-Agasa may choose to give out his "kick shoes." These have no function (unless we want them to have one), but Agasa gets them back the next day and gets to know whether or not they "fit," that is, whether the recipient is a child or not. So a way for Agasa to potentially find allies. It was also suggested that if the recipient is a child, he/she could use them as a discombobulation device that night.
-Agasa can only give out two items per day, so he has to choose between the shoes, bowtie, and watch.

-

Thoughts? (I was just gonna give Anokata detain, but :x)

These all seem fair to me (granted, I dunno what other changes are in place atm, so I have nothing to compare it to, but I like the idea of these). I would probably not have the shoes be able to discombobulate, though.

[Raiden]

New item to be added to all male roles (except children--also remove panties from Haibara, not sure if that was suggested already though): Boxers/Briefs . . .except Akai & Gin which goes commando. :p

[PT]

also remove panties from Haibara

Who keeps re-adding those!? We've removed that item I don't even know how many times now. -_-

[Vylash]

also remove panties from Haibara

Who keeps re-adding those!? We've remove that item I don't even know how many times now. -_-

Dunno, I've removed them before and someone keeps putting them back in

[Raiden]

also remove panties from Haibara

Who keeps re-adding those!? We've remove that item I don't even know how many times now. -_-

Dunno, I've removed them before and someone keeps putting them back in

Remove the panties item from Ayumi and Haibara.

Clarification: (The Mafia wiki aka FM has them removed, in the MM thread however they are still added)

[Akonyl]

Remove the panties item from Ayumi and Haibara.

oh dear

[pofa]

Here are the answers I'm getting to some of the things I asked about a couple of weeks ago. Considering making these changes official, but there's still time to object:

Most people seem to want cloak of deception to have a time limit of three phases still.

Vermouth should retain her scent even when using Master of Disguise.

Injured BO can use the abilities set into the BS from the black manual, same as if they were using an item from Agasa.

Here's my suggestion regarding the killing actions; feel free to disagree. They should go through IF the action went through to a point where the BO can be successfully investigated/arrested for the attack. So if the attack was successful, but the target was then healed or protected (in which case, "x kills y" will still come back true and an arrest can happen), I think it's fair for the BO's killing action to work that night. Since the killing action technically went through and something just happened afterward. On the other hand, if the killer was discombobulated or confused, the killing action wouldn't go through.

I'm making detect a targetless investigate. Mostly because I like it that way, but also because nobody seems to have a strong objection to it.

Nobody seems to care for adding FU to Takagi and Chiba except for hopeless. I kind of like it, but if not many people want it, I won't bother with it for this round.

I think I will add the option to "gender observe" this round, with the limitation that you can't use both types of observe on the same person.

@Yukiko and Irish: It seems useless to me to be given a disguise as Yukiko or Irish that I can't use because it only has a day action. I would suggest to make "Temporary disguise" a night action that extends into the following day phase. Therefore, "Yukiko disguises as Kazuha N1" and "Yukiko disguises as Kazuha D1" would both come back true. And then N2 she disguises as someone else. Then at the end of the third day, she gets a new rotation of disguises and can either disguise immediately on N4 or has to wait till N5, whichever seems fairest.

I'd like to remove Yamamura's "Clumsy" status and simply give him back "confuse" again, but I'm not sure I want him to be immune to discombobulation like he was before. :/

I'm thinking of letting Anokata have the "Blackmail" ability as an option (Frame OR Blackmail). Blackmail would be a crime, and Anokata could only redirect a "type" of action once per game, which I think should go with the investigation categories with day actions added in (so can be used on actions with targets). So he could redirect heal/first aid, protect/snipe guard, interrogate, investigate/SI, observe/stakeout, discombob/confuse, follow/accompany, Identify, Give Bowtie/Give Watch, Charm, only once. (I'd also maybe make Blackmail investigate as "discombobulate" since it's so similar to "confuse," except with an ability + victim rather than a target + victim.)

Giving Agasa the child-finding kickshoes as an option, because why not. He can only give out two items per day phase though. Kickshoes will leave a note just like bowtie and watch, but have no function other than "fitting" or not.

I'm also seriously considering removing spy/deduct from the round and replacing it with the above suggestions for Bourbon, Yusaku, and Okiya.

Still haven't decided what to do about Sonoko, whether to go back to having her learn her friend's killer or keep Gossip. Gossip seems a little OP'd to be able to use every night.

If Irish is disguised as a woman, Irish has panties that can be stolen. Still not sure why we had a problem with Irish!panties and not Kid!panties.

Children don't have stealable panties.

No bottle and no volatile APTX in this round.

[Akonyl]

@ a few of those things (now that I'm in this thread :V)

Detect being a targetless investigate: Do you mean in the way it's investigated ("Okiya investigates")? Because without a target it seems like people would know it's a detect action anyway.

FU? Unless this stands for "Fusion" where Takagi and Chiba can ID each other to become one ultra-stakeout supercop, curious what that is

The only reason that I added in the discombob-immunity to Yamamura was because I foresaw the addition of another discombobulation that could potentially redirect discombobulations to the possible discombobulation trainwreck as being annoying to make a ruling on, so as long as you can find a way to solve that I don't see why he'd need it.

for Sonoko, if you're getting rid of deduction lists because it's no fun to be caught by them, I'd think it's especially not fun to be caught because you just so happened to off Sonoko's BFF

also, when was the black manual added in outta curiosity? I think I remember talking about something like that but I wasn't aware it was actually ever put in :V

[Raiden]

Okay, will try to give input on your suggestions pofa.

Here's my suggestion regarding the killing actions; feel free to disagree. They should go through IF the action went through to a point where the BO can be successfully investigated/arrested for the attack. So if the attack was successful, but the target was then healed or protected (in which case, "x kills y" will still come back true and an arrest can happen), I think it's fair for the BO's killing action to work that night. Since the killing action technically went through and something just happened afterward. On the other hand, if the killer was discombobulated or confused, the killing action wouldn't go through.

Seems fair to me. =)

Nobody seems to care for adding FU to Takagi and Chiba except for hopeless. I kind of like it, but if not many people want it, I won't bother with it for this round.

I think I will add the option to "gender observe" this round, with the limitation that you can't use both types of observe on the same person.

I wouldn't mind either if you included FU to Takagi and Chiba. \o/ (Although if you doesn't, I won't cry over it. XD)

Seems fair with the gender observe only being once per player thing. ^^;

@Yukiko and Irish: It seems useless to me to be given a disguise as Yukiko or Irish that I can't use because it only has a day action. I would suggest to make "Temporary disguise" a night action that extends into the following day phase. Therefore, "Yukiko disguises as Kazuha N1" and "Yukiko disguises as Kazuha D1" would both come back true. And then N2 she disguises as someone else. Then at the end of the third day, she gets a new rotation of disguises and can either disguise immediately on N4 or has to wait till N5, whichever seems fairest.

I'm all okay with that! <3

I'm thinking of letting Anokata have the "Blackmail" ability as an option (Frame OR Blackmail). Blackmail would be a crime, and Anokata could only redirect a "type" of action once per game, which I think should go with the investigation categories with day actions added in (so can be used on actions with targets). So he could redirect heal/first aid, protect/snipe guard, interrogate, investigate/SI, observe/stakeout, discombob/confuse, follow/accompany, Identify, Give Bowtie/Give Watch, Charm, only once. (I'd also maybe make Blackmail investigate as "discombobulate" since it's so similar to "confuse," except with an ability + victim rather than a target + victim.)

Worth given it a try.

Giving Agasa the child-finding kickshoes as an option, because why not. He can only give out two items per day phase though. Kickshoes will leave a note just like bowtie and watch, but have no function other than "fitting" or not.

More powah for Agasa! <33 (What about the bento box fax machine which I mentioned on previous page, though? :x)

I'm also seriously considering removing spy/deduct from the round and replacing it with the above suggestions for Bourbon, Yusaku, and Okiya.

I'm okay with that. =)

If Irish is disguised as a woman, Irish has panties that can be stolen. Still not sure why we had a problem with Irish!panties and not Kid!panties.

Children don't have stealable panties.

Beats me too why people objected to Irish having panties and not Ayumi/Haibara. The latter seems more disturbing than the former... :V

Also, also!
_{Are you including what was discussed in IRC last night/early morning, about the ruling for Akemi/KID if they stole from Bourbon/Okiya/Akai? :p}

No bottle and no volatile APTX in this round.

We all know how Parkur will beg and cry for you to include'em.



RM'd by Akonyl...

FU? Unless this stands for "Fusion" where Takagi and Chiba can ID each other to become one ultra-stakeout supercop, curious what that is

It's Follow-Up, it's included in the MM rules. =)

[Akonyl]

ah, so the SO investigate, gotcha.

[Raiden]

ah, so the SO investigate, gotcha.

You're idea about how Takagi/Chiba becomes a stronger, near-invincible super cop is cool too, though!

Takaba! The Super Cop which beats down the Black Organization! XD

[Kleene Onigiri]

Here are the answers I'm getting to some of the things I asked about a couple of weeks ago. Considering making these changes official, but there's still time to object:

Most people seem to want cloak of deception to have a time limit of three phases still.

Vermouth should retain her scent even when using Master of Disguise.

Injured BO can use the abilities set into the BS from the black manual, same as if they were using an item from Agasa.

Here's my suggestion regarding the killing actions; feel free to disagree. They should go through IF the action went through to a point where the BO can be successfully investigated/arrested for the attack. So if the attack was successful, but the target was then healed or protected (in which case, "x kills y" will still come back true and an arrest can happen), I think it's fair for the BO's killing action to work that night. Since the killing action technically went through and something just happened afterward. On the other hand, if the killer was discombobulated or confused, the killing action wouldn't go through.

I'm making detect a targetless investigate. Mostly because I like it that way, but also because nobody seems to have a strong objection to it.

Nobody seems to care for adding FU to Takagi and Chiba except for hopeless. I kind of like it, but if not many people want it, I won't bother with it for this round.

I think I will add the option to "gender observe" this round, with the limitation that you can't use both types of observe on the same person.

@Yukiko and Irish: It seems useless to me to be given a disguise as Yukiko or Irish that I can't use because it only has a day action. I would suggest to make "Temporary disguise" a night action that extends into the following day phase. Therefore, "Yukiko disguises as Kazuha N1" and "Yukiko disguises as Kazuha D1" would both come back true. And then N2 she disguises as someone else. Then at the end of the third day, she gets a new rotation of disguises and can either disguise immediately on N4 or has to wait till N5, whichever seems fairest.

I'd like to remove Yamamura's "Clumsy" status and simply give him back "confuse" again, but I'm not sure I want him to be immune to discombobulation like he was before. :/

I'm thinking of letting Anokata have the "Blackmail" ability as an option (Frame OR Blackmail). Blackmail would be a crime, and Anokata could only redirect a "type" of action once per game, which I think should go with the investigation categories with day actions added in (so can be used on actions with targets). So he could redirect heal/first aid, protect/snipe guard, interrogate, investigate/SI, observe/stakeout, discombob/confuse, follow/accompany, Identify, Give Bowtie/Give Watch, Charm, only once. (I'd also maybe make Blackmail investigate as "discombobulate" since it's so similar to "confuse," except with an ability + victim rather than a target + victim.)

Giving Agasa the child-finding kickshoes as an option, because why not. He can only give out two items per day phase though. Kickshoes will leave a note just like bowtie and watch, but have no function other than "fitting" or not.

I'm also seriously considering removing spy/deduct from the round and replacing it with the above suggestions for Bourbon, Yusaku, and Okiya.

Still haven't decided what to do about Sonoko, whether to go back to having her learn her friend's killer or keep Gossip. Gossip seems a little OP'd to be able to use every night.

If Irish is disguised as a woman, Irish has panties that can be stolen. Still not sure why we had a problem with Irish!panties and not Kid!panties.

Children don't have stealable panties.

No bottle and no volatile APTX in this round.

Truth revealed: Mafia discussion is all about panties!

I like the solution from pofa with the BO killing action

Yaaamaaamuuuraaa \o/


Also, what exactly do you plan for Okiya?
Coz I thought people didn't like the Uehara ability XD

[Vylash]

Question: if the shoes don't fit, does the person still know that agasa tried to give it to them?

[PT]

Question: if the shoes don't fit, does the person still know that agasa tried to give it to them?

I would assume so, yes.

@pofa: I agree with all of those, I think. And I have no opinion regarding Sonoko.

Beats me too why people objected to Irish having panties and not Ayumi/Haibara. The latter seems more disturbing than the former... :V

Also, also!
_{Are you including what was discussed in IRC last night/early morning, about the ruling for Akemi/KID if they stole from Bourbon/Okiya/Akai? :p}

We have. Several times. More than I can count.

Eh? What's this about stealing from them?