Ai + Conan

[kyuuketsuki]

{...}
First of all, Ai doesn't want Conan to tell Ran that he's Shinichi because it might put her to danger.
{...}

Haibara's intervention in volume 26 wasn't to protect Ran. She didn't even care particularly about the kids' safety when she first met them. (1a. 1b. 1c.) I doubt she'd even care much if Ran were killed until after volume 42, or possibly volume 31.

*Taking one deep breath*
Why do I get the feeling that you're making Ai sound so selfish? I mean how would you know if she would care if Ran were killed in episode 345? Just because Gosho didn't write much about it doesn't mean Ai won't care. Anyways, Ai did warm up to her after Ran saved her

Because she is? I mean, no offense to her, but she is a scientist. And scientists are all pretty selfish.Its nothing against the people, I know because I am one too. Scientists tend to be just tend to be very selfish (the ends justify the means), and egotistical (because they think they are smarter than everyone, which they usually are). She uses Kudo for her research. Half the time she doesn't tell him about it. and each time she fairly accurately estimates the timespan in which he will be back to normal. Yet she doesn't tell him... (probably would be helpful to him if he were told, so that he can finally tell Ran). But she never does, because she wants the test to be fully unaffected by any variables that wouldn't be normally encountered. In fact, whenever he does return to his normal body, she normally instructs him to stay in the shadows, or return to Agasa's house. Now most would think that is so that he wouldn't be noticed by the BO, but... who is to say she cares about him (given she probably does to some degree, as I have stated earlier)? But she also fears of her own exposure... That and she wants to OBSERVE him (ever notice how she goes out of her way to time when he turns back to the second?) She is the classic scientist, who cares little about people, but more in the data that would further her research. Many scientists are scorned for that. Only forensic scientists avoid scorn, but that is because, even if they don't care about people, they can argue that they do, because most of the forensic research is not harmful to anyone, and benefits people by putting the badguys in jail more effectively. And that is also why most of the major science discoveries are made in countries with lax laws. (Korea and cloning, Nazi Germany and several advancements in scientific research, among others)

[Nyarl]

{...}
First of all, Ai doesn't want Conan to tell Ran that he's Shinichi because it might put her to danger.
{...}

Haibara's intervention in volume 26 wasn't to protect Ran. She didn't even care particularly about the kids' safety when she first met them. (1a. 1b. 1c.) I doubt she'd even care much if Ran were killed until after volume 42, or possibly volume 31.

*Taking one deep breath*
Just because Gosho didn't write much about it doesn't mean Ai won't care. Anyways, Ai did warm up to her after Ran saved her

I think Aoyama's written enough to show that Haibara needs a reason to care in the first place. She is selfish. Barring some unrevealed backstory similar to Golden Apple where Ran did interact with Shiho in the past, she didn't have much reason* to care before volume 42.

* She'd probably feel bad for Shin'ichi if he lost Ran, but keeping the secret from Ran for the reason she gave in volume 26 wouldn't really decrease the chance he'd lose Ran and live long enough to regret it.

Because she is? I mean, no offense to her, but she is a scientist. And scientists are all pretty selfish.Its nothing against the people, I know because I am one too. Scientists tend to be just tend to be very selfish (the ends justify the means), and egotistical (because they think they are smarter than everyone, which they usually are).

Haibara's Org. upbringing probably had more influence on her ethics than her being a part of your already dubious scientist stereotype.

[Misztina]

Hm... here is how I look at their relationship:

Shiho escaped from the BO and ran to Shinichi the only possibly living person, who can help her. In the first few cases we see how she flirts ( IMO). Why? I don't think she particulary saw anything in Shinichi in the first place. There was an interesting quote from Akemi about that Shiho should find a boyfriend for herself rather than working like this.
After the escape I think Shiho wated to try out how "real life" is, including getting a boyfriend. Maybe it sounds harsh to say that she was testing her social and charming skills, but I think that this would be the case. Imagine a girl who didn't have much chance to build friendship not to mention love realtionship with others until she was ca. 20. Now she is more or less free, there is a nice boy beside her, so...basicly her chance was given.

However, she became the one who actually started to develop deeper feelings towards Shinichi. I'm not quite sure when this process took place, nor when she realized that she has feeling for him, but in Volume 26 she already blushed when Shinichi asked her why would she do this and that for his sake. And there is the blushing scene in the Vol.26. Come spring-case too.

Then took the bus-hijack case place, where she decided to stop this "normal life" thing, because she is not suited for this, not to mention the danger of BO is also very intensive. But then she was saved as we know.

Then took the Missing watch case place, where once again is proven how Shiho and Shinichi think alike. Shinichi said he wouldn't make Ran cry again, even if it means that he would no longer exist in her heart and Shiho shares the same opinion by saying (still unsure if she said that in Japanese to but nvm.) that "Pitiful. Both you and I.".
Shiho is aware of the fact that Shinichi loves Ran, and after introducing herself to Ran she sort of acknowledges Ran. And she sees how well Shinichi and Ran may fit together.

Yet I  think that she didn't give up on him just because of this. I the Hooligan case in Vol. 35 she already made him say that he is going to protect her. Shinichi is not really(not always) conscious about his relationships and things as Heiji said back in the Desperate Revival case. He doesn't think that if he says something like: I'm gonna protect you- could be misunderstood (wonder if Ran will misunderstand it once she realize what's happening). I guess Haibara is trying to convert Shinichi's "protect a friend" feelings to "protect the girl I love" feelings. Or maybe not. I'm not sure.

I cannot go on because I have to do other things. But maybe later.

[Nyarl]

Anyway, as for how Ran x Shinichi is interesting, I've given a bit of thought about this.  Now that I've discovered Detective Conan, Ran x Shinichi has actually become a schema of sorts for certain types of relationships in my mind, like my previous focus Shirley x Lelouch from Code Geass.  First of all, I guess I'll admit that Ran x Shinichi probably isn't interesting from an 'outside' perspective; there's a strong aspect of loyalty or faithfulness, as if they couldn't even imagine themselves with someone else, so I you lose out on the ideas of 'she's a good catch' or 'he's a perfect boyfriend'; courtship just isn't an issue here.  Instead, I am drawn by the 'inside' perspective, what they see in each other--because you can tell, just by the way they treat each other, that it's something (from their own perspectives) very powerful.

To put forth some of the thoughts I've had: to Ran, Shinichi is a role model, something of an anchor in terms of identity.  As we saw in the Golden Apple case, Ran, despite her strength, is very sensitive about the idea of hurting others.  With regards to why, I think maybe a defining aspect of this kind of character is that they don't see or put themselves above others.  Regardless, the net result is that Ran lacks initiative, and is a bit afraid to put herself forward; so she's a bit frustrated with that, or trying to change it.  So from this perspective look at Shinichi: strong, confident, speaks with conviction.  He's passionate about what he does in a way that moves his whole life forward; he's never at a loss for what to do.  For someone who struggles with blaming herself instead of others, he must look cool, right?  With all his theatrics about 'putting evil behind bars'.  As a result, she emulates him--when Ran is faced with situations which make her doubt herself, other people, or the world, she thinks to herself 'what would Shinichi do?'.  And as we've seen a couple times, she comes out dazzling.

With that said, I think overall, Shinichi as a role model is much more important to Ran than Shinichi as a lover.  However, it's also true that status as a role model that makes him so attractive to her.  Because Shinichi is someone she trusts and admires on such an inherent level, any attraction to other men will hardly register.

My thoughts on Shinichi are a bit less concrete.  They're probably a bit interspersed with my own feelings.  However, what I think is, to Shinichi, Ran is a miracle.  An ordinary, but--more than that--beautiful (I don't mean (just) physically) person in the face of a world filled with murder, blackmail, adultery, suicide.  Someone who has (personally!) confronted them and remains kind, gentle, warm.  It isn't just the crimes themselves; as a detective, Shinichi must have a firm grasp of the psychology behind these actions.  So it might be people like Ran, someone devoid of hate, deceit, arrogance or self-interest, that he feels are most worth protecting.

Sorry, that doesn't explain it well.  Those are all mundane, logical, reality based things.  What I want to say is that to Shinichi, Ran is something a bit profound.  Listen to how he describes her (from the Memories of a First Love case): "She is strong, stubborn, but gentle and sensitive.  She has everything in her."

...

Well, hell.  Okay, compositional copout here.  Basically, I don't know what to say about that statement.  I can't really explain it.  All that's clear to me is that to Shinichi, Ran is something a little bit spiritual.  And that's interesting, makes Detective Conan more interesting than a conventional romance manga because it's not about love, it's about how these characters' lives, their very existence is changed by the presence of a single other person.

I wanted to write that I enjoy reading your interpretations and think you make a lot of good points in this. (Though I think you* might be idealizing Ran a touch, since she does occasionally fall into jealousy and unjustified/misguided wrath.)

* Heh, or at least your conception of Shin'ichi's view.

[mam]

@Sol Falling, I second Nyarl, thoroughly enjoy reading your thoughts. And though you already emphasized that was your own opinion, it's still very interesting to see Ran from Shinichi's POV.

People perceive things differently, I just want to say thank you to all of you who give reasonable discussion in this topic, not bashing others' favourite characters.

@Girl19, sorry I didn't reply to you last time, read your post, thnks for understanding

I understand your point of view here, and I have no doubt that their love will triumph in the end. Ran and Shinichi have been in love since.. always, and their love has grown stronger with the distance. But what makes me feel, sometimes, bored while watching them, is the lack of intrigue and development in their story. I'm not saying there is no development at all, but it's not enough (for me). On the other hand, a love relationship between Haibara and Conan would have been much more interesting and realistic if Gosho ever gave it a try...

Then we must blame Gosho here, ha ha ha, he really drags their romance. Of course I don't want a scene which Conan tells Ran he loves her through the bowtie's voice. But I desperate for simple thing like he tells her directly he misses her, or that she’s someone the most important to him, not with a “as a friendâ€

[Rellik]

i agree with wat Girl19 said, ConanxAi would def be an interestin plot if Gosho gives it a try, but i wont like it being permanent.

i say that it would be perfect if Conan falls in love with Ai, then realise how important Ran is to him and goes back together wit Ran. Of course this kind of plot will fail badly if Gosho dsnt make it convincin tat Conan isnt just treatin Ai as an object which he can just dispose of.

[haibarakudo]

Hm... here is how I look at their relationship:

Shiho escaped from the BO and ran to Shinichi the only possibly living person, who can help her. In the first few cases we see how she flirts ( IMO). Why? I don't think she particulary saw anything in Shinichi in the first place. There was an interesting quote from Akemi about that Shiho should find a boyfriend for herself rather than working like this.
After the escape I think Shiho wated to try out how "real life" is, including getting a boyfriend. Maybe it sounds harsh to say that she was testing her social and charming skills, but I think that this would be the case. Imagine a girl who didn't have much chance to build friendship not to mention love realtionship with others until she was ca. 20. Now she is more or less free, there is a nice boy beside her, so...basicly her chance was given.

However, she became the one who actually started to develop deeper feelings towards Shinichi. I'm not quite sure when this process took place, nor when she realized that she has feeling for him, but in Volume 26 she already blushed when Shinichi asked her why would she do this and that for his sake. And there is the blushing scene in the Vol.26. Come spring-case too.

Then took the bus-hijack case place, where she decided to stop this "normal life" thing, because she is not suited for this, not to mention the danger of BO is also very intensive. But then she was saved as we know.

Then took the Missing watch case place, where once again is proven how Shiho and Shinichi think alike. Shinichi said he wouldn't make Ran cry again, even if it means that he would no longer exist in her heart and Shiho shares the same opinion by saying (still unsure if she said that in Japanese to but nvm.) that "Pitiful. Both you and I.".
Shiho is aware of the fact that Shinichi loves Ran, and after introducing herself to Ran she sort of acknowledges Ran. And she sees how well Shinichi and Ran may fit together.

Yet I  think that she didn't give up on him just because of this. I the Hooligan case in Vol. 35 she already made him say that he is going to protect her. Shinichi is not really(not always) conscious about his relationships and things as Heiji said back in the Desperate Revival case. He doesn't think that if he says something like: I'm gonna protect you- could be misunderstood (wonder if Ran will misunderstand it once she realize what's happening). I guess Haibara is trying to convert Shinichi's "protect a friend" feelings to "protect the girl I love" feelings. Or maybe not. I'm not sure.

I cannot go on because I have to do other things. But maybe later.

Um....I don't think Ai was trying to convert Shinichi's 'protect a friend" feelings to "protect the girl I love" feelings. Because she knows what she deserves and she certainly knows that Shinichi's heart belongs to Ran. Even though she has feelings for him, she keeps it to herself

[haejin]

Ai and Conan is a nice couple. But we all know that Shinichi x Ran is a canon pairing. And I don't think Gosho Aoyama-san would break a million fans' hearts. XDDD

All I can see is that, since Shinichi/Conan sees the same situation he is in on Ai. That's why he's by her side or so. =)

[haibarakudo]

Ai and Conan is a nice couple. But we all know that Shinichi x Ran is a canon pairing. And I don't think Gosho Aoyama-san would break a million fans' hearts. XDDD

All I can see is that, since Shinichi/Conan sees the same situation he is in on Ai. That's why he's by her side or so. =)

Actually, there are more Coai supporters in Japan than Shinran supporters.....so maybe Gosho would rethink his DC ending

[Chekhov MacGuffin]

Actually, there are more Coai supporters in Japan than Shinran supporters.....so maybe Gosho would rethink his DC ending

I'm a little skeptical that there are more Conan x Ai supporters given that the split is slightly in Ran's favor according to a few our forum polls. Are you sure that information is correct? Please note that I am neutral in this issue, I was just wondering if there was an official poll that I missed.

[LDCF]

Ran is the girl who is angelic enough to wait for Shinichi for 12 years and stay devoted to him.

it cant be that ran is waiting for 12 years. conan would be older than the original shinichi and ran would be 30 years old!

can anyone tell me how many time passed since shinichi shrunk?
i guess its only a few months, are there any clues to that?

tks

I think when he said 12 years, he's referring to the age of the anime series. Well, on 'Detective Conan' time, 12 years is only equivalent to a couple of months! xD

an example of this is at one of the episodes in the clash of red and black series is when they said that Akemi died a few months ago, but that episode [128] already happened more than five years ago! xD

well, sorry if my reasoning's kinda "blurry" XDD

[haibarakudo]

Actually, there are more Coai supporters in Japan than Shinran supporters.....so maybe Gosho would rethink his DC ending

I'm a little skeptical that there are more Conan x Ai supporters given that the split is slightly in Ran's favor according to a few our forum polls. Are you sure that information is correct? Please note that I am neutral in this issue, I was just wondering if there was an official poll that I missed.

Well, I don't really have solid evidence since I only heard about it on other forums of that but I do for Ai's popularity. Click this link to view: http://www39.atwiki.jp/detectiveconan/pages/27.html

[Introuble]

Gosho would never rethink switching from ShinXRan to CoXAi that would just ruin the first 120 episodes, the movies and the hearts of millions of fans....ALL of those EPISODES revolving around the ShinXRan relationship would be thrown into a waste can then lit on fire put into a space shuttle which would go into space and get demolished by some meteor and POOF everything gone and lost forever!!


MY REACTION IF EVER SHINICHI DITCHES RAN
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02MV3DD5 ... re=related
But of course as long as DC has a great ending I'd still be happy

[Rellik]

lol 1 of the replies on that utube video made me laugh so hard 

well all it takes is Ran to 'disappear' and CoXAi would come in.

P.S i dont want that to happen myself lol - but i wouldnt mind if Shinichi dies though

[haibarakudo]

Gosho would never rethink switching from ShinXRan to CoXAi that would just ruin the first 120 episodes, the movies and the hearts of millions of fans....ALL of those EPISODES revolving around the ShinXRan relationship would be thrown into a waste can then lit on fire put into a space shuttle which would go into space and get demolished by some meteor and POOF everything gone and lost forever!!


MY REACTION IF EVER SHINICHI DITCHES RAN
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02MV3DD5 ... re=related
But of course as long as DC has a great ending I'd still be happy

Then why the heck would Gosho wanna create Coai scenes if they're not gonna end together (I'm not saying they will definitely end up together and there is a chance)