Is Sharon a BO member?

[Shuuichi Akai]

1) Is Sharon's Funeral. The key words are PUBLIC and MOVIE STAR. A private funeral I can see Chris getting away with a closed casket. But this was a PUBLIC EVENT. Also to kill rumors about still being alive, it would be a very good idea for it to have been open casket. Closed casket in this case would start rumors about if the person was really dead or not. Such rumors would cause Reporters to try and get their scoop by showing sharon alive.

Sharon is jewish, and in jewish funerals you're not supposed to see the body. There, this ends this conflict  :P

Thus it was most likely Open casket and this makes your wax idea likely to get found out. Remember at this event are reporters who might be trying to prove Sharon alive. They are going to look over the body very carefully.

Actually, I've seen it done in fiction before (the use of wax puppet in a casket), and only when one of the characters touched the body, it broke and they found it wasn't real. Until then, everyone thought it was a real body.
Point is, DC is fiction, and such method would be used in fiction had you wanted to have a body. Just like the DC masks are perfect, a wax doll can also be perfect enough to fool reporters.

2) has to do with reporters watch and reporting every move either Sharon or Chris make.Again done wrong they will be rumors about them being the same person

You are expecting Gosho to go REALLY deep into this whole thing.

3) Has to do with can you remove a mask glued to your face without remove the makeup under it

eh......actually, there are types of makeup that wouldn't be damaged even by water.
Also, if you're going so deep into the mask conflict, why do we never see some remains of the mask (from the glue) on Vermouth's face after she removes the mask?

Sharon  is Jewish??? Did the Manga mention that!?

I thought the smiley implied I was only joking.....
I very much doubt Gosho would ever insert any religous related issues. I've never actually seen a jewish character in a manga/anime.

You just shocked me! I thought I missed some important information about one of my favorite characters.

[Nyarl]

1) Is Sharon's Funeral. The key words are PUBLIC and MOVIE STAR. A private funeral I can see Chris getting away with a closed casket. But this was a PUBLIC EVENT. Also to kill rumors about still being alive, it would be a very good idea for it to have been open casket. Closed casket in this case would start rumors about if the person was really dead or not. Such rumors would cause Reporters to try and get their scoop by showing sharon alive.

Sharon is jewish, and in jewish funerals you're not supposed to see the body. There, this ends this conflict 

Thus it was most likely Open casket and this makes your wax idea likely to get found out. Remember at this event are reporters who might be trying to prove Sharon alive. They are going to look over the body very carefully.

Actually, I've seen it done in fiction before (the use of wax puppet in a casket), and only when one of the characters touched the body, it broke and they found it wasn't real. Until then, everyone thought it was a real body.
Point is, DC is fiction, and such method would be used in fiction had you wanted to have a body. Just like the DC masks are perfect, a wax doll can also be perfect enough to fool reporters.

2) has to do with reporters watch and reporting every move either Sharon or Chris make.Again done wrong they will be rumors about them being the same person

You are expecting Gosho to go REALLY deep into this whole thing.

3) Has to do with can you remove a mask glued to your face without remove the makeup under it

eh......actually, there are types of makeup that wouldn't be damaged even by water.
Also, if you're going so deep into the mask conflict, why do we never see some remains of the mask (from the glue) on Vermouth's face after she removes the mask?

Sharon  is Jewish??? Did the Manga mention that!?

I thought the smiley implied I was only joking.....
I very much doubt Gosho would ever insert any religous related issues. I've never actually seen a jewish character in a manga/anime.

Sharon denying the existence of "Kami-sama" touched on religion... It was probably homage to C.S. Lewis's Screwtape Letters, too. (Vermouth==Wormwood)

[Chekhov MacGuffin]

1) Is Sharon's Funeral. The key words are PUBLIC and MOVIE STAR. A private funeral I can see Chris getting away with a closed casket. But this was a PUBLIC EVENT. Also to kill rumors about still being alive, it would be a very good idea for it to have been open casket. Closed casket in this case would start rumors about if the person was really dead or not. Such rumors would cause Reporters to try and get their scoop by showing sharon alive. This might make it hard for Chris to do her BO duties. Thus it was most likely Open casket and this makes your wax idea likely to get found out. Remember at this event are reporters who might be trying to prove Sharon alive. They are going to look over the body very carefully.

The casket is closed in this picture. QED.

Spoiler:

That doesn't matter though. Also as I said before, you can use a wax sculpture as those are extremely lifelike, and even more so in this situation because dead people don't have to move or get touched by random people. Also I disagree about your point with the reporters carefully examining and trying to prove she would be alive; usually it's only the conspiracy theory wackos who come up with the X celebrity is not dead ideas and not respectable reporters likely to be invited to said funeral. I couldn't find a news article about reporters touching bodies in caskets when they weren't supposed to do so.

I'll let you skate on points two and three until you decide to elaborate.

[sstimson]

1) Is Sharon's Funeral. The key words are PUBLIC and MOVIE STAR. A private funeral I can see Chris getting away with a closed casket. But this was a PUBLIC EVENT. Also to kill rumors about still being alive, it would be a very good idea for it to have been open casket. Closed casket in this case would start rumors about if the person was really dead or not. Such rumors would cause Reporters to try and get their scoop by showing sharon alive. This might make it hard for Chris to do her BO duties. Thus it was most likely Open casket and this makes your wax idea likely to get found out. Remember at this event are reporters who might be trying to prove Sharon alive. They are going to look over the body very carefully.

The casket is closed in this picture. QED.

Spoiler:

That doesn't matter though. Also as I said before, you can use a wax sculpture as those are extremely lifelike, and even more so in this situation because dead people don't have to move or get touched by random people. Also I disagree about your point with the reporters carefully examining and trying to prove she would be alive; usually it's only the conspiracy theory wackos who come up with the X celebrity is not dead ideas and not respectable reporters likely to be invited to said funeral. I couldn't find a news article about reporters touching bodies in caskets when they weren't supposed to do so.

I'll let you skate on points two and three until you decide to elaborate.

Those kind of reporters ( tabloids ) are the kind I am talking about. If Chris is and always was Sharon, then those kind of reporters are going to do everything they can including touching a dead body to get their story. Think about it for a second. You got two very famous movie stars.
When one vanishes, the other appears. How long do you think it will be that they ( the reporters ) start thinking the two movie stars are one?
Think of how much money the reporter who learns the truth is going to get for their news making report that proves that Sharon is Chris. They might also start thinking Sharon was murdered by Chris. I can see these reporters hounding Chris to tell the truth. Again in real life note how much of a nuisance these kind of reporters can be. They would never give Chris a moment of rest. Face it. It best for the Bo and Chris if they are completely convinced that Sharon is dead and the Chris is not Sharon. Only once these reporters are happy about that does Chris get any time to safely do her Bo actives without the world press following her every move trying to prove the former. It would hurt the Bo if every crime was reported on and watched as it happened. Also while the lid might be down at the time of the drawing, that does not mean it was never opened during the funeral service.

[Abs.]

Normally, funerals are private affairs.

[Chekhov MacGuffin]

Those kind of reporters ( tabloids ) are the kind I am talking about. If Chris is and always was Sharon, then those kind of reporters are going to do everything they can including touching a dead body to get their story. Think about it for a second. You got two very famous movie stars.
When one vanishes, the other appears. How long do you think it will be that they ( the reporters ) start thinking the two movie stars are one?
Think of how much money the reporter who learns the truth is going to get for their news making report that proves that Sharon is Chris. They might also start thinking Sharon was murdered by Chris. I can see these reporters hounding Chris to tell the truth. Again in real life note how much of a nuisance these kind of reporters can be. They would never give Chris a moment of rest. Face it. It best for the Bo and Chris if they are completely convinced that Sharon is dead and the Chris is not Sharon. Only once these reporters are happy about that does Chris get any time to safely do her Bo actives without the world press following her every move trying to prove the former. It would hurt the Bo if every crime was reported on and watched as it happened. Also while the lid might be down at the time of the drawing, that does not mean it was never opened during the funeral service.

You are misinterpreting the manga completely. Chris was never missing to begin with, to the news people, she just stayed in private a lot. Vermouth still did interviews and gave out interviews disguised as Chris when the Sharon disguise was still alive. Most reporters aren't conspiracy theory loonies and wouldn't suspect elaborate deception. There is even evidence that the reporters believed it; they aren't writing stories about Sharon = Chris which Agasa would have probably seen people writing about on the fan page of Chris if such speculation existed.
Also casket is closed = no touching. You can't prove it was ever an open casket funeral. Also even the worst kind of paparazzi don't seem to go as far as touching bodies at funerals when they aren't supposed to, otherwise I would expect Google News to turn up lots of articles about dead people being violated. Also who the heck cares about tabloid reporters? The FBI aren't going to believe them, the intelligent general public won't believe them.

[sstimson]

Those kind of reporters ( tabloids ) are the kind I am talking about. If Chris is and always was Sharon, then those kind of reporters are going to do everything they can including touching a dead body to get their story. Think about it for a second. You got two very famous movie stars.
When one vanishes, the other appears. How long do you think it will be that they ( the reporters ) start thinking the two movie stars are one?
Think of how much money the reporter who learns the truth is going to get for their news making report that proves that Sharon is Chris. They might also start thinking Sharon was murdered by Chris. I can see these reporters hounding Chris to tell the truth. Again in real life note how much of a nuisance these kind of reporters can be. They would never give Chris a moment of rest. Face it. It best for the Bo and Chris if they are completely convinced that Sharon is dead and the Chris is not Sharon. Only once these reporters are happy about that does Chris get any time to safely do her Bo actives without the world press following her every move trying to prove the former. It would hurt the Bo if every crime was reported on and watched as it happened. Also while the lid might be down at the time of the drawing, that does not mean it was never opened during the funeral service.

You are misinterpreting the manga completely. Chris was never missing to begin with, to the news people, she just stayed in private a lot. Vermouth still did interviews and gave out interviews disguised as Chris when the Sharon disguise was still alive. Most reporters aren't conspiracy theory loonies and wouldn't suspect elaborate deception. There is even evidence that the reporters believed it; they aren't writing stories about Sharon = Chris which Agasa would have probably seen people writing about of the fan page of Chris if such speculation existed.
Also casket is closed = no touching. You can't prove it was ever an open casket funeral. Also even the worst kind of paparazzi don't seem to go as far as touching bodies at funerals when they aren't supposed to, otherwise I would expect Google News to turn up lots of articles about dead people being violated. Also who the heck cares about tabloid reporters? The FBI aren't going to believe them, the intelligent general public won't believe them.

No you are missing what I am trying to say.

First that the casket was closed in that drawing does not mean it was a closed casket. The casket must be opened from a closed state and then closed after. All that drawing shows is a state at which the casket was closed. It does not mean it was always closed or that it was a closed casket service. A lot of people are going to be very unhappy it they can not say goodbye to the face of their movie heroine, or can not see one last time their star.

Second you are using the wrong search: try this http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=dead+body+touching&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=

Third it is not a matter of Chris missing or not. It is like this: Chris arrived and Sharon leaves a house reporters are watching. Some of these reporters will follow Sharon. Some will continue to watch the house for Chris. When Sharon gets back those same reporters are still there because Chris never left the house. Then the same thing happens with Sharon. The reporters are going to figure out pretty quick that neither leaves the house while the others are gone. and Some are going to ask why. Some of those might start thinking that maybe Sharon is Chris and are going to see if they can find ways to prove it. After all it might be their stepping stone to a real news job. Your point about no stories kinda of proves this point. There were no stories about one being the other because they were indeed two people, with two completely different lives and so there was no way to prove or even think one was the other because indeed these two groups both left their post to follow their story star could find the other group gone because indeed the other left while the first was out.

You asked why worry about tabloid reporters. Well the answer is simple. Most of those are looking for ways to become 'real' reporters and if they can discover and report the story of the year, they can almost write their own ticket. And also if some of these do find out the truth and disappear or die suddenly, then others might put two and two together and find a way to report the real story. Just remember the reporter,'s picture showing Pisco shooting the light. I got a feeling he was able to write his own ticket.

[Abs.]

Who says "Sharon" and "Chris" were living together?

[sstimson]

Who says "Sharon" and "Chris" were living together?

Well if Chris is Sharon then both must be at the same place . Now if they are different people then they do not need to be together. One could living and working in America while the other is in Japan maybe filming a picture.

[Chekhov MacGuffin]

First that the casket was closed in that drawing does not mean it was a closed casket. The casket must be opened from a closed state and then closed after. All that drawing shows is a state at which the casket was closed. It does not mean it was always closed or that it was a closed casket service. A lot of people are going to be very unhappy it they can not say goodbye to the face of their movie heroine, or can not see one last time their star.

You can't prove when or where it was opened. It might have been brought to the location the funeral was at closed, so no reporters ever saw it. It's pointless speculating without evidence. Also, Chris as next of kin would make all the decisions regarding funeral arrangements, she can keep it closed, public be damned if she so wishes.

Second you are using the wrong search: try this http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=dead+body+touching&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=

This is irrelevant to the main point of contention. The important bit is reporters touching dead bodies when they aren't supposed to be touching them. Yes, some people have open casket funerals and let people touch the body. Now, how many superstars have funerals where the body is off limits and reporters open the casket and touch them anyway without permission?

Spoiler:

Third it is not a matter of Chris missing or not. It is like this: Chris arrived and Sharon leaves a house reporters are watching. Some of these reporters will follow Sharon. Some will continue to watch the house for Chris. When Sharon gets back those same reporters are still there because Chris never left the house. Then the same thing happens with Sharon. The reporters are going to figure out pretty quick that neither leaves the house while the others are gone. and Some are going to ask why. Some of those might start thinking that maybe Sharon is Chris and are going to see if they can find ways to prove it. After all it might be their stepping stone to a real news job. Your point about no stories kinda of proves this point. There were no stories about one being the other because they were indeed two people, with two completely different lives and so there was no way to prove or even think one was the other because indeed these two groups both left their post to follow their story star could find the other group gone because indeed the other left while the first was out.

No, the lack of stories doesn't prove the point; it can equally well indicate Vermouth did a good job of making her two personas seem like different people. Vermouth has the FBI watching her real life identity's every move and she still manages to get out and commit crimes. If she can manage that, I am sure she can trick a gaggle of reporters.

So far you offered up the possibility that somehow a dedicated/really rude reporter could have figured out something was up with Chris and Sharon and guessed they were the same person. Fine. However, you have failed to to prove that said reporter/story actually exists nor have you ruled out with evidence the explanation that the lack of stories about Sharon=Chris is because Vermouth is a really good actor who is excellent at manipulating people - a well supported fact.

[sstimson]

First that the casket was closed in that drawing does not mean it was a closed casket. The casket must be opened from a closed state and then closed after. All that drawing shows is a state at which the casket was closed. It does not mean it was always closed or that it was a closed casket service. A lot of people are going to be very unhappy it they can not say goodbye to the face of their movie heroine, or can not see one last time their star.

You can't prove when or where it was opened. It might have been brought to the location the funeral was at closed, so no reporters ever saw it. It's pointless speculating without evidence. Also, Chris as next of kin would make all the decisions regarding funeral arrangements, she can keep it closed, public be damned if she so wishes.

Concede the point that we do not know which way it was: open or closed

But again with reporters. Which would serve the BO interest more: Crazy reporters trying to find the 'dead' Sharon, or reporters who know she is dead, has seen her dead, can prove she is dead and died of natural causes. A Closed Casket would lead to unwanted rumors and unwanted reporters investigations. You said to keep things simple. What would be easier then letting the reporters there see there is no story and that Chris is retiring from Movie life. They go away and Chris can do as she pleases without any unwanted attention.

Second you are using the wrong search: try this http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=dead+body+touching&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=

This is irrelevant to the main point of contention. The important bit is reporters touching dead bodies when they aren't supposed to be touching them. Yes, some people have open casket funerals and let people touch the body. Now, how many superstars have funerals where the body is off limits and reporters open the casket and touch them anyway without permission?

Spoiler:

Third it is not a matter of Chris missing or not. It is like this: Chris arrived and Sharon leaves a house reporters are watching. Some of these reporters will follow Sharon. Some will continue to watch the house for Chris. When Sharon gets back those same reporters are still there because Chris never left the house. Then the same thing happens with Sharon. The reporters are going to figure out pretty quick that neither leaves the house while the others are gone. and Some are going to ask why. Some of those might start thinking that maybe Sharon is Chris and are going to see if they can find ways to prove it. After all it might be their stepping stone to a real news job. Your point about no stories kinda of proves this point. There were no stories about one being the other because they were indeed two people, with two completely different lives and so there was no way to prove or even think one was the other because indeed these two groups both left their post to follow their story star could find the other group gone because indeed the other left while the first was out.

No, the lack of stories doesn't prove the point; it can equally well indicate Vermouth did a good job of making her two personas seem like different people. Vermouth has the FBI watching her real life identity's every move and she still manages to get out and commit crimes. If she can manage that, I am sure she can trick a gaggle of reporters.

So far you offered up the possibility that somehow a dedicated/really rude reporter could have figured out something was up with Chris and Sharon and guessed they were the same person. Fine. However, you have failed to to prove that said reporter/story actually exists nor have you ruled out with evidence the explanation that the lack of stories about Sharon=Chris is because Vermouth is a really good actor who is excellent at manipulating people - a well supported fact.

Did you forget which side I on? No reporter / story supports my ideas. If such a story did exist, it would support your side not mine.

Again how be reporters no be suspicious of one person playing two parts. A true Skido sure, they could keep it up for a very long time. Are you suggesting that Chris is Skido and has two personalities : Chris and Sharon. Again if that were true I sure they would be some kind of story reporting such even as a lie. Again such missing suggest that the reverse is easy to prove and so there is no story. I am asking could a normal person without being Skido play act two completely differently personalities without ever slipping and going into the wrong one for at least ten years?

Spoiler:

We also have Yukiko say "come on. your proud of her. We know Yukiko has known Sharon for a very long time. Yukiko is much more observant then most give her credit for. I am sure that when Chris was young maybe around 7 or 8, she met Chris and noticed how Sharon and Chris got along. You are most likely to slip around friends. Are you saying the Sharon - Yukiko friendship was also a lie? Yukiko herself by that comment seem to suggest they are indeed two different persons.

[terra]

How many clues in DC were given off-screen? We see a picture of a closed casket – we can assume it was closed all the time. If it was open, I still doubt anyone, would touch the body – even at MJ’sor Lady Diana’s funerals wasn’t such an accident occurring. So we can have a waxed body… OR, because I believe Sharon = Chris = Vermouth, she could use somebody’s else body and with her make-up skills change the appearance. The pathologists that would examine her body could be BO-related, etc… Speculating sure feels nice. In the country I live in, we have such cases, when the pathologists confirmed a body is the supposed dead person, but later on it is discovered that was just one huge lie and a different body was buried. 

We know Chris was popular, not as much as Sharon. So it’s also a question how many people would wonder if she’s really dead or not. Also it would mostly depend on the way she died. But those are only speculations. When you have a successful actress, they want to keep their lives private. We’re not talking about Hollywood stars or anything like that. Yukiko is also said to be very popular – why aren’t there any crazy stalkers of her or persistent paparazzo’s during any of the cases she appears?

[Chekhov MacGuffin]

I am sure that when Chris was young maybe around 7 or 8, she met Chris and noticed how Sharon and Chris got along.

There's no proof this occurred so it's irrelevant.

We also have Yukiko say "come on. your proud of her. We know Yukiko has known Sharon for a very long time. Yukiko is much more observant then most give her credit for... You are most likely to slip around friends. Are you saying the Sharon - Yukiko friendship was also a lie? Yukiko herself by that comment seem to suggest they are indeed two different persons.

I believe the friendship was genuine, but obviously Sharon wasn't being honest in it by hiding her other side as Vermouth. Yukiko genuinely liked Sharon and I want to think Vermouth felt the same way about Yukiko even though she was acting. Note that Yukiko didn't try to deny Shinichi's deduction that Sharon = Chris = Vermouth, meaning that Yukiko must have realized it might be true even if she didn't want to believe it.

Spoiler: V42.10

[sstimson]

I am sure that when Chris was young maybe around 7 or 8, she met Chris and noticed how Sharon and Chris got along.

There's no proof this occurred so it's irrelevant.

I disagree. I got this idea from Yukiko Comment. If I am right about how long they have been friends, then there is a very good chance Yukiko met a very young Chris. If that happened then for all the time Chris could not have always been Sharon. You have the idea that there was either never a Chris or never a Sharon. If Yukiko had never met a Young Chris and watched the Mother's proud look over her child, then why her comment?

We also have Yukiko say "come on. your proud of her. We know Yukiko has known Sharon for a very long time. Yukiko is much more observant then most give her credit for... You are most likely to slip around friends. Are you saying the Sharon - Yukiko friendship was also a lie? Yukiko herself by that comment seem to suggest they are indeed two different persons.

I believe the friendship was genuine, but obviously Sharon wasn't being honest in it by hiding her other side as Vermouth. Yukiko genuinely liked Sharon and I want to think Vermouth felt the same way about Yukiko even though she was acting. Note that Yukiko didn't try to deny Shinichi's deduction that Sharon = Chris = Vermouth, meaning that Yukiko must have realized it might be true even if she didn't want to believe it.

Spoiler: V42.10

One thing we are disagreeing on is when Sharon / Chris became the other. I think it did happen, but only for a very short time span. You seem to think that it happened from day one. Sharon is too famous for a daughter to come from nowhere. In order for a daughter to be thought of as real, the time progression must have happened. There is no way Sharon could pretend to be younger that 20 years old. Who knows when the Daughter Chris began her film career. But if it was younger then 20 then in those years it could have not been Sharon. So in order for the public to believe that Chris is Sharon daughter, there had to be a young Chris and that could not have been Sharon.

[Abs.]

I am sure that when Chris was young maybe around 7 or 8, she met Chris and noticed how Sharon and Chris got along.

There's no proof this occurred so it's irrelevant.

I disagree. I got this idea from Yukiko Comment. If I am right about how long they have been friends, then there is a very good chance Yukiko met a very young Chris. If that happened then for all the time Chris could not have always been Sharon. You have the idea that there was either never a Chris or never a Sharon. If Yukiko had never met a Young Chris and watched the Mother's proud look over her child, then why her comment?

Yukiko's comment in no way alludes to her actually having witnessed Sharon looking at Chris with a proud expression on her face.