Rum Arc Discussion Thread (Plot + Characters)

[Mohamed Ebrahem]

So based on the conversation between Kobayashi and Rumi regarding the discussion concerning "Karasuda" or crow... it seems that Rumi doesn't seem to have an entirely black impression regarding the image of 'that person related to crow'... if 'that person' whom she had in mind was the Ano-kata or the BOSS that may be connected to Karasuma... then i can't possibly imagine that the 'dying-message' pointing towards 'Karasuma' that was left at Kohji's death scene could be left by Rumi. So who would possibly leave a message that points to 'Karasuma' AND try to implicate RUM who screwed up in this case by doing so? Surely not another BO member would risk doing so? But what if it were left by someone who knew about the Karasuma group and thought that they were kinda shady? And speaking of unnecessary coincidences....

There are some conclusions that I am sure of and i will tell you and you can believe it or not , you are free friend

1- Rum is Karasuma, and is Chikara Katsumata .
Focus more and try to imagine the shape of Reina Karasuma when he was in fifties , and look at the Chikara shape in the picture in front of you.





2 -Anokata or boss is Hyogo Kaneshiro . he is Okinawa governor .
The meaning of Kanji's name is Soldier of the Golden Castle .
Focus on the background of the person that vermouth look at and then look at Hyogo Kaneshiro .
Email of the boss is 9696261
meaning of these numbers in japanese hiragana :
9 = Kyuu / Ku .
6 = roku .
2 = ni .
1 = ichi .
After playing with words and rearranging the letters, you can get Kuro Hyogo Kaneshiro = ( Black Hyogo Kaneshiro ) .





3- Iori Mujah is very young since 17 years ago to be RUM or Asaca , he was 13 years old that time .

[Zerozaki4869]

I've given up on fitting X into Y. My new approach is based on why and how. I think if I can answer why and how correctly then I can also know who with a shred of doubt.
Now during my early days I believed in a hidden 4th/5th suspect. That's because the way the narrative set up the story before the release of Special Digest Black , which had a confirmation that Rum was one among Kuroda, Rumi and Wakita. Then I reflected on it and realised that there is no logical and convincing way to inserting a fourth subject in this unless I use illogical and unverified assumptions. So I dropped it.

Narrative did set up the story in way which makes
a) Kuroda-> A suspect with a firewall. He gets the cleared off by Haibara just after his introduction. Haibara even described how he possibly isn't Rum. Then came the camping ground case and Rumi became the centre of suspicion due to the Haibara's radar. Even his communication with Amuro is modelled in such a way that nobody would think he is calling Amuro as Rum.
b) Rumi-> She is an overly suspicious person, but the suspicions are spelled out by Conan/Haibara. Later when Haibara also gives her the clean chit, it came off as an emotional decision unlike the level headed deduction of Haibara in Kuroda's case.
c) Wakita-> He bears a baggage of meta hints of being Rum, association with Rum's pet phrase, via "Time is Money."---"Toki wa Kanenari", he was seen talking about traitors, it seems Amuro's cover was protected from him.

Both Rumi and Wakita are your traditional red herrings while Kuroda is a suspect with a firewall.

If You look at them conventionally, You can't deny the existence of a 4th hidden culprit.

But there's a catch. If You reread the detective's Nocturne you can see something spectacular. If a nearby BO member is dead serious, haibara feels the pressure. During the chase seen Haibara felt pressure from Amuro but Amuro didn't even notice Haibara. Now add this with Haibara's proclamation that " don't badmouth Rumi at any cost.", when just a couple of files ago she was scared of her and one file ago she was thinking that how Rumi's one eye could be bad. So She was sure that Rumi is BO, moreover Rum. Haibara is mature enough to know that a BO agent even if not Rum shouldn't be taken at face value even if they do heroic deeds. (Vide Vermouth arc.)

Now one can ask what about the list?
There are plenty of NOC's in BO so anyone of them could have provided her with the screenshot/pdf/scanned copy.
Now add this with Kuroda using a different number to call Kansuke to get through to Komei, when he needs to get Komei asap. So this new number and calling via Kansuke makes no sense if the job was urgent. More like Kuroda doesn't want this to get tracked back to him.

[Kor]

3- Iori Mujah is very young since 17 years ago to be RUM or Asaca , he was 13 years old that time .

I agree, but at the same time, you also believe Kuroda is Kouji's father, but his given age makes him too young for that. Do you think Kuroda's given age is a lie, then?

[blackmoon]

3- Iori Mujah is very young since 17 years ago to be RUM or Asaca , he was 13 years old that time .

Well, i wouldn't judge someone's ability just based on their age alone... especially when their age happens to be the number 13, but of course... that's someone from another story.



On the other hand, i don't think the pair here in the Conan story are just for show only.

[Mohamed Ebrahem]

3- Iori Mujah is very young since 17 years ago to be RUM or Asaca , he was 13 years old that time .

I agree, but at the same time, you also believe Kuroda is Kouji's father, but his given age makes him too young for that. Do you think Kuroda's given age is a lie, then?

Good note from you my friend
Many fans also think that Wakasa Rumi is a rum , even if 17 years ago she was 20 years old .
If Rum was not killed by the organization because of his mistakes , this means that time he is also the second most important member of the BO , this also contradicts when you find a person of 20 years old has such a great position in the organization . I cannot understand how a 20-year-old woman ( not man ) is Rum ?!!

But there are personal opinions from me to deny any relation to the organization and such opinions are that I excluded Iori Muga and Kuroda from being Rum or Asaka because of their appearance in 21st and 22nd movies , respectively .

[Mohamed Ebrahem]

Well, i wouldn't judge someone's ability just based on their age alone... especially when their age happens to be the number 13, but of course... that's someone from another story.

Your saying that we do not judge someone if he is 13 , this may serve my opinion about Kuroda , who is now 50 years old , I do not rule out that he got married at the age of 13 and gave birth to Haneda Kohji and Haneda died at the age of 20 , since 17 years ago .

On the other hand, i don't think the pair here in the Conan story are just for show only.

Like you , I think new characters may have a role in the main confrontation between the organization and Conan team .
But as for Momiji , I think she will only be a competitor against Kazuha for who will be heiji hattori's love .
As for Iori Muga , my personal belief is around him but without evidence that he is MI6 agent .
Your words are true about a 13-year-old child may have very large and high skills , but To be RUM !! , I think it is impossible .
In Conan anime , I think when a person appears with his identification card , his age is correct , unless there is an edit from Goshu after that . his name may be a pseudonym/not real , but age I think is mostly correct .

[Mohamed Ebrahem]

Now during my early days I believed in a hidden 4th/5th suspect . before the release of Special Digest Black , which had a confirmation that Rum was one among Kuroda, Rumi and Wakita. Then I reflected on it and realised that there is no logical and convincing way to inserting a fourth subject in this unless I use illogical and unverified assumptions. So I dropped it.

Your words are true, but Goshu is a mysterious anime author and has the right to disguise the fans , but there is saying which I like " the reader has the right to suspect everyone" . I have been tricked by Goshu many times , but after Arc Bourbon and Vermouth , we got used to that and started thinking better . I don’t know why I insist on that , but this time I’m sure Chikara Katsumata is Rum .
What will fans do when the identity of Rum appears and he is not among the three suspects , if we asked Goshu but you said that Rum is one of the three , what is your reaction if Goshu said " oh well there was a fourth hidden suspect , but you did not ask me about him , this is not my fault For not realizing that " .

Both Rumi and Wakita are your traditional red herrings while Kuroda is a suspect with a firewall.

For Wakita , very easy hints are refering to him and these hints can be noticed by children , I do not think Rum will put an eye patch if his eye is artificial as Haibara said .
I can not imagine that Goshu will rebeat the main antagonist of the arc like he did in the previous arc with easy hints refering , I can not predict that this time from Goshu . We saw that Agasa cheat in the puzzle in beginning of the arc , also word "Juke" in case of Haneda Kohji , this word means a some kind of tricks in America sports . so this Arc will have many tricks .
For Wakasa: I don't think the organization's prime minister is hinting to Conan solving the cases and he has that time to go on trips with the Detective boys .
Chikara Katsumata , his daughter says that he is busy with his other students, do you imagine that he is so busy that his daughter is going to learn shogi from another person , how he is busy with his students and his daughter is not among these students , unless these students are .....

Now one can ask what about the list?
There are plenty of NOC's in BO so anyone of them could have provided her with the screenshot/pdf/scanned copy.

I don't think there is someone in the BO has that recent list other than Haibara . Suppose that Wakasa is Rum , why was she looking at that list in your opinion , you might answer me " because she suspected that Conan is Kudo Sinchi and she went to make sure of his name in the list " , so why has not killed him yet , but still hints to him for solving the cases and saved them from the vault of the farm in 1054 , even though the vault of the farm is a suitable place to kill Conan and Haibara , or perhaps killing everyone , including Amoru and Kazami , and why did Goshu show us that Wakasa Rumi was examining the list and next to her a shogi piece ??

Gin was about to kill Conan even though he was a child in episode 425 because he just kicked the ball and prevented them from aiming towards Mori , Gin poisoned Kudo Sinchi only because Kudo saw them exchanging deals in episode 1 , not stopped after hitting him on head but piosoning him also .
Can you just imagine actions of Wakasa Rumi , do you really think that Rum has this void, this passion , and this kind ?
I cannot imagine that Rum will be the new member of detective boys with Kobayashi sensi .
We are talking about a serious member is called RUM not about a clown nor a Member of the circus .

[MeiTanteixX]

In Conan anime , I think when a person appears with his identification card , his age is correct , unless there is an edit from Goshu after that . his name may be a pseudonym/not real , but age I think is mostly correct .

[Kor]

Also Okiya's age is a lie too. Akai is older than 27.

[Mohamed Ebrahem]

In Conan anime , I think when a person appears with his identification card , his age is correct , unless there is an edit from Goshu after that . his name may be a pseudonym/not real , but age I think is mostly correct .

Also Okiya's age is a lie too. Akai is older than 27.

that number of false age persons is very few compared to many characters in the anime , and still Akai's age not shown yet .

[Zerozaki4869]

Okiya Subaru -> Nobody to verify his age/occupation etc. He gets a virtual free run in this.

The case suspect -> She also gets a virtual free run till the victim found it.

Iori Muga-> He is the butler of the most influential family of Japan. The family who can mandate JSDF personnel to use choppers to rescue Heiji, can ensure that the Governor of Tokyo calls on an individual just because the daughter wished it. To lie and infiltrate such a household would be nearly impossible. So Muga is waht he says he is.

[MeiTanteixX]

In Conan anime , I think when a person appears with his identification card , his age is correct , unless there is an edit from Goshu after that . his name may be a pseudonym/not real , but age I think is mostly correct .

Also Okiya's age is a lie too. Akai is older than 27.

that number of false age persons is very few compared to many characters in the anime , and still Akai's age not shown yet .

In File 1037, it was revealed that Akai was 15 years old 17 years ago. Just do the math and you will know in-story that he is 32.
Otherwise:

[Kor]

And also, Chris Vineyard's age is obviously fake as well.



The reason I'm pointing out the fake ages is because a few pages ago you wrote:

6- He did not has an identification card that tells us his name and age, Chikara himself said his name and this is very doubtful because his age is very very large considering that he is a Karasuma and therefore it will be confusing to fans if someone appears in his card has 140 years for example .

But clearly Gosho has no problem noting fake ages for characters with fake identities, so if Gosho wanted to give Katsumata a card, he could have given him any age (and you could still argue it's a fake age regardless, but the absence of a given age doesn't mean his age holds some big secret).

[Mohamed Ebrahem]

In File 1037, it was revealed that Akai was 15 years old 17 years ago. Just do the math and you will know in-story that he is 32.

And also, Chris Vineyard's age is obviously fake as well.
But clearly Gosho has no problem noting fake ages for characters with fake identities, so if Gosho wanted to give Katsumata a card, he could have given him any age (and you could still argue it's a fake age regardless, but the absence of a given age doesn't mean his age holds some big secret).

Despite the appearance of Chikara Katsumata on the key hole of Volume 85, but he did not have an identification card in his first and second appearance as well , all we knew about him his name because he said it himself , do you think that Goshu forgot to show identification card for a person who has a key hole in his first appearance !! This card appeared for Okiya Subaru, Wakasa Rumi , Kuroda and most of the characters in their first appearance , do you also think that Goshu cannot draw two identical eyes to Chikara in all the drawings even in the key hole ??!!
I mean, what is the reason for not showing his identification card, and not knowing his age , also why are his eyes not identical in your opinion ??

[Mohamed Ebrahem]

Looking at the past arcs, the main antagonist usually appears in some shape or form before the first 100 files of the arc(in Bourbon arc, "Scar Akai"/Bourbon appeared after 55 files), so unless we assume something like Asaka=Rum and Asaka hasn't been introduced yet, then it's more likely that Rum has already been introduced.

If you want to go with the interview, then Gosho said in the recent "let's talk"(Jan 2017):
"His/her name haven't shown up, in a sense! Maybe his/her face has appeared...?"
As if to imply that something else besides Rum's real name (like a fake name) has appeared. Assuming that Rum's fake name appeared during Rum arc, then we can come to the conclusion that Rum's face has been revealed, since no character besides Asaka has appeared with a name but without a clearly revealed face(unless one thinks that Asaka=Rum).

Chikara his name hasn't shown up , but his face has appeared