Changes to Mini-Mafia Game

[PT]

Hey guys, the final changes, based on what the majority seems to want, look like this:

» Anokata: He will become similar to his current FM iteration. He will be given a town role that is not in the game and will become that role, similar to disguise. He can be investigated as that role, but he is not susceptible to Arrest for the disguise or Pinch. He cannot become Sonoko, Yumi, Haibara or Conan. He will always have a scent, regardless of his role. He will always have a BO interrogation result, regardless of his role, unless he is slandered.
» Irish: remove Abduct.
» Pisco & Tequila: They will have Abduct, Frighten, Erase and Fake. At night, they can use Fake/Erase/Abduct [OR] Fake/Erase/Frighten. They cannot be in the game together.
» Akemi: She will be given Fake and Follow. She will be able to use Fake AND Steal at night, Follow during the day.
» Black Suitcase: Remove Fake. Change to Blame x1 AND BO Slander x1 OR Town Slander x1.
» Eri: Change night actions to Cross Examine x1 OR Interrogate x1.
» Kujou: She will be removed from the game.
» Kobayashi: Change night action from First Aid to Heal.
» Detective Boys: They will be removed from the game temporarily while we further discuss how best to use them.
» Kazuha: She will be given Heal as a night action. Charm will be removed from her.
» Haibara: She will be given the Charm. It will be renamed to Antidote and will not send a notification to the person she uses it on UNLESS it is used to save that person from poison. It will still only be useful for one save.
» Agasa: No change will be made to Agasa.
» Araide: He will be removed from the game.
» Asami: She will be renamed to Sera and given headgear.
» Kir: Give her a scent.
» Akai: Add BO Interrogation.
» Okiya: Add BO Interrogation.
» BoneBreak: Will be renamed to SnipeGuard.
» Amuro: Add new role.

[PT]

Note: I am opening this up for discussion because that's what needs to happen with any changes. But if people start being jerks/whining about stuff (like last time), then I'm dropping out of the discussion entirely and will leave you guys to figure it out on your own. It's not worth the stress it causes me.

More suggested changes, please discuss!

» Makoto: He is currently not disguisable, so we need to adjust that. (He should've have been made disguisable in the first place, this was just an oversight.) FIXED!
» Kazuha: Same as Makoto. FIXED!

» Children: Basically ever since the DBs got removed, Conan and Haibara get poisoned nearly every time they're in the game, pretty much as soon as they get observed. And I think all of us who have experienced this are tired of it. So I'm suggesting (after discussing with a few people) bringing the DBs back in. HOWEVER, I don't want to bring them back as they were because quite honestly, they sucked. And we all know it. They were a hindrance for the town more than they were for the BO.

So! I'm suggesting we remove their group status. And then I'm suggesting giving them abilities that are actually worth something.

Ayumi
Night Action: Detect, Investigate 2*
Faction: Town
Interrogation: Not BO
Scent: No
Age: Child
Sex: Female
Disguiseable: No
Items: School book, Headgear

*If people prefer differentiating her abilities from Mitsuhiko, alternate suggestions were [Detect OR Investigate 3] or [Detect OR Interrogate]

Mitsuhiko
Night Action: Detect, Investigate 2*
Faction: Town
Interrogation: Not BO
Scent: No
Age: Child
Sex: Male
Disguiseable: No
Items: School book

*Alternate suggestions for Mitsuhiko were [Observe, Investigate 2].

Genta
Day Action: Identify, Accompany*/**
Faction: Town
Interrogation: Not BO
Scent: No
Age: Child
Sex: Male
Disguiseable: No
Items: School book

*I personally think it would be best to keep one DB with only day actions, that way Haibara (currently the only role that does not have any night actions at all) has a little bit of cover. This could be up for discussion. However if we make ALL of them only have day actions, then Conan would have no cover as the only child with night actions. So I was trying to find a balance there.

**Alternate suggestions for Genta were [Identify, Follow] or [Detect, Follow] (if we want to make him have a night action after all).

Discuss! Make other suggestions if you have them!

This is personal preference, but I think we should stick with existing abilities and not make any new ones at this point in time. I don't want people having to relearn the game and/or trying to balance new abilities against old ones.

[Jecka]

I like Ayumi and Mitsu having night actions, makes them less useless. As for Genta...I'd go with giving him Id + Follow.

[Yurikochan]

I don't think Following needs any other actions, I'm for either idea on Genta, and do like Mits/Ayumi being night actions.

[MoonRaven]

Or what if we removed all kids from the game? No Conan or Haibara. Or is that too radical of a decision?

[PT]

Removing them is an option, but then we have to adjust Akemi's actions (again), because she would be the only with Follow at that point, and she's already a little too easy to spot from stealing anyway. So if people want them removed, then we also need suggestions on what to do with Akemi.

[Yurikochan]

Removing them is an option, but then we have to adjust Akemi's actions (again), because she would be the only with Follow at that point, and she's already a little too easy to spot from stealing anyway. So if people want them removed, then we also need suggestions on what to do with Akemi.

If people want them removed why not make Teen Haibara or town Sherry. :x

[Jd-]

One suggestion that was floated in those original discussions was to change the parameters on observe from "Child/Teen/Adult" to just "Young/Adult". May or may not help solve this problem, but re-introducing the D-Boys with separate identities sounds OK too.

[Fujiwara]

Or what if we removed all kids from the game? No Conan or Haibara. Or is that too radical of a decision?

You want to remove the main character for the game?

I mean, I get that observe is a problem, but that could also be solved by making observe results binary - adult or non-adult. Game balance is important, but removing the main characters in favor of side character that people have trouble recognizing seems the wrong direction to take. That just makes me sad. ;__;

[KangarooGirl]

I'd be in favour of making the observe results adult/non-adult. Sounds like it'd be the best solution at the moment although we could still add DBs with different actions too.

Edit: Coz it's not exactly clear maybe (still half asleep :x). I think even if we add Dbs with other actions, people will still try aptxing Conan/Haibara first (as they did before) so it's still not going to solve that issue.

[PT]

Someone else brought up the point about still trying to poison Conan/Haibara first, but here's the thing: more children in means that it's less likely to actually BE Conan or Haibara, thus more failed APTXes. Then, once people get used to seeing the DBs back in, they'll stop and think before auto-poisoning Conan or Haibara... especially if we make the DBs just strong enough to actually be useful. Obviously if we brought them back in as they were, people would just be like "I'll poison for Conan/Haibs because DBs suck and are not a threat to us."

I personally am against the binary adult/non-adult observe results (and removing children altogether) just because it really weakens Observe more than I'd like. Amuro would then have a greatly watered-down observe and SI1. Snipers would suffer pretty badly because yeah, they can SO but they don't have FU and Observe isn't all that useful except for finding potential cops (which even then is not a high probability, since adults are the most common age).

I dunno, just my opinion. We'll see what other people say.

[pofa]

Had a suggestion in #minimafia about Observe:

Possible results change to "Younger Adult, Older Adult, Not an Adult"

Young people are either children or teens, and the adult roles are split from younger to older (Nakamori, James, Agasa, Eri, Pisco, etc. for older adults; Akai, Satou, Yumi, etc for younger adults).

Just something that was suggested and requested to post that might give Conan and Haibara more cover.

[KangarooGirl]

Personally I'd rather the Db being added back in than splitting the adults like that. =\ I think splitting the adults is quite ambiguous, unlike Adult, teen, child. It's like where do we draw the line and even when we do, I'm not sure if there's a benefit for BO or town to do it that way =\

Dunno I'd go with either binary observe or Dbs in or both.

[Jd-]

Just posting an idea for adding a little twist to the existing mafia formula that could make things interesting.

In this special game mode, which we'll call... Lottery Wagers, you have a chance to choose what role you'll end up with. In the Wager Phase™, everyone gets to choose three town roles that they would like to inhabit should they end up as a town player. Let's say you chose Satou, Amuro, and Conan. You would now have a +10% chance of being Satou, a 7% chance of being Amuro, and a 5% chance of getting Conan. The usual balancing parameters (whatever they are/should they exist) would still apply, so there wouldn't just be 6 cops versus 3 Black Org members even if all townies got their desired roles.

This adds an extra layer to the game, in that you may expect certain players to go for certain roles/certain types of roles. Others may go for obscure roles to reduce the likelihood of APTX or just to play against expectations of their playstyle. Could be fun. This could also be twisted however is needed, by possibly making it so that you get +15% chance for only one role and you don't get any back-ups, etc.

Of course, normal rules apply: There can't be two people with the same role and there won't be any disruption to the allocation of Black Org players vs. town.

[Yurikochan]

Personally I'd rather the Db being added back in than splitting the adults like that. =\ I think splitting the adults is quite ambiguous, unlike Adult, teen, child. It's like where do we draw the line and even when we do, I'm not sure if there's a benefit for BO or town to do it that way =\

Dunno I'd go with either binary observe or Dbs in or both.

What she said, what she said.