Mafia! Mafia! Mafia! Character Role Discussions

[Grawwbear]

The only reason I want a standby GM is so that if I don't have enough free time during my travels to Europe I don't have to worry so much about the exact time of posting. Maybe I can do what Callid did when he was GM and perhaps post earlier when I have to...

[Abs.]

EDIT: Also, it says Kazuha can give a player a protection charm once per game. Does this mean that she can only give one charm per game (it's a once-a-game action), or that she can only give the charm to any one player once per game, and has to choose someone else the next night?

Once-a-game action.  I'll make this more clear, thank you!

[Kleene Onigiri]

Nice work abs.!  :-*

Why can Lovers win when both are arrested? Or is that in case they are Bo/bo for example?
I don't know how they can win when they are town/BO and both are arrested D:

The leader ranking has nothing to do with the APTX ranking! In case there are not enough APTX, then the ranking of the listed BO roles will be used.

People were confused by that in the round I GMed. So maybe leaving it like that or if they make a ranking list, the APTX will be according to that list instead.

The Leader can decide to give the Black Suitcase to any member during the game. He/she can also list substitutes for the Suitcase in case the target(s) is/are killed during the day.

Clarify if the leader has to give out the Case to himself too or not (in case the BO forgets to give it to someone *cough*)
So, in case the leader forgets to Pm the Gm with a list, if the leader got the Case or not. So whether the case can be used for that one phase or not.

* Spy
- Role with that action: Irish
- Irish chooses a list of players not in the BO equal to 1/3 of the number of town players (= number of APTX). Of these, the GM picks a random one and sends the name of the role to Irish. Irish will not know from which of the players he just learned the role
- He will only know there is a "Shinichi" in the list of 5 players (= 14-16 town players), but not which one of these 5 players really is Shinichi
- This does not reveal if someone is 1412, Irish will just get the disguised role

Well, the number of town players in the list is the same number of APTX. But if there would be a game with a low number of players, then I think there should be a minimum of Town players Irish has to pick from? Since with just 3 townroles it's easier to know. So a minimum of 4 or 5 maybe?
Not sure if this is needed tho.

* Heal
- Role with that action: Araide
- Can use Heal on any player, including himself.
- The healed player doesn't die because of Killing or Sniping. Can't heal APTX or a wounded person or an injured Ran.
- If there is a attack that was successfully healed, everyone involved (also protectors (Ran, Makoto) and Okiya) will NOT know the attackers identity
- The attacker will know that the target was Healed/First Aided, but not from whom and if there were any protectors involved.
- Watch protection > Protect > Heal > First Aid: see under rules

I agree that healing doesn't reveal the identity. but the part:
- If there is a attack that was successfully healed, everyone involved (also protectors (Ran, Makoto) and Okiya) will NOT know the attackers identity

Sounds strange since protecting > healing. So in case Protectors are involved then the protect will take effect before Healing anyway. So the Identity of the attacker will be know to the protector and the target. But what about araide that also healed the target?

It logical that Okiya doesn't get to know the attackers identity. But will Okiya know that araide healed the same target and succeed? Or if it was a protector instead?

* Discombobulate
- Roles with that action: Eisuke, Vodka
- People that were discombobulated will fail with their night action on the same night.
- This doesn't affect Day actions.
- The people discombobulated will get a PM from the GM that their night action failed. They will only get a notice in case they used a night action. If they have a night action and didn't use it or have a day action or no active action, they won't know that they were discombobulated via PM.
- The Night action Arrest can't be discombobulated in any way. All other night actions can be discombobulated. You can also discombobulate the interrogation/investigation that the player was able to do through the Bow-tie from Agasa. Protection from the tranquilizer watch can be discombobulated too. You can also discombobulate the "fake investigations" that are possible through the Black Suitcase.
- Travel can be discombobulated!
- Discombobulation can prevent the BO from killing or sniping someone.
- If a discombobulated action is investigated, then the action will be shown as "false", because the action wasn't done in the end.
- May NOT discombobulate themselves, because it will discombobulate the GM.
- Vodka: If the BO Leader commands Vodka to kill his lover, Vodka MAY discombobulate the Leader to prevent this action.  This case is the ONLY override to a BO Leader's order.  Beware: The Leader will be notified that he was discombobulated, and will know that Vodka was the only one who could have done it.

If Eisuke discombobulate the leader, will an order be "nullified"?
Or just in case a BO lover was ordered to kill his lover (Vermouth to kill Satou for example) and the BO leader was discombobulated be Eisuke, then the killing is also hindered or not?

* Protection Charm
- Role with that action: Kazuha
- Can give a person the Protection Charm once per game. The next Day, the target will have his/her lynching votes reduced by 1 and be protected from APTX poisoning.
- The APTX will still be used up.  BO won’t know charm was in play.
- Can give charm to herself.
- Not subject to discombobulation.
- Works like Agasa’s gadgets: Kazuha won't know the identity of the one who received the Charm. The one who got the Charm will just know that Kazuha gave it to him/her, not the identity of the player.

If it's just once per game than Kazuha will be even more useless than Ran and her suicide before. The player will probably hold back and Kazuha using her charm will be as rare as arresting before.
And she will have a action that can be used just once. She doesn't have any other actions after that and is pretty much a commoner then. She doesn't get any infos either. (she didn't get any before either, but she could at least use her charm and maybe prove her own role with that if she wanted)

Example 2: (Day 3)
Beastly) APTX pofa = Satou.
pofa) Arrest Beastly for using APTX on pofa on Day 3.
Result: pofa arrests Beastly.  Beastly does not get to use APTX on pofa.  APTX is confiscated. (See APTX under Day actions)

because at the time of the arrest, the crime hasn't happened. Imo, you should only be able to arrest on actions that have been done successfully, not actions that are happening in the same phase as you're performing the arrest. But, if there's already rules that go with this, *shrug*

You can't arrest someone for a crime that wasn't done yet. So you can't arrest Beastly on the same day he uses APTX.
There was a question about that before, but I didn't add it to the rules afterward D:

The example was like that:
Night2 -
Vodka kills Pofa.
Pofa arrest Vodka on night 2 for killing pofa.

So, if you can arrest someone for a crime that happens in the same phase, it would be like that:
Vodka ties to kill Pofa. But Pofa arrest Vodka for killing pofa on night 2. So, Vodka get's arrested, but Pofa didn't die. So Vodka didn't do that crime actually, so he was arrested falsely. But if Vodka isn't arrested, then Pofa dies and he actually did the crime..... paradox?! D:

So I decided to not let that happen and you can't arrest someone for a crime that's done in the same phase (was asked when I was GMing round 9, but forgot to change that in the rules D:)

But Pofa can arrest Vodka for intimidating Sherry on day 1 for example. Then Vodka get's arrested and Pofa will stay alive.

Same goes for APTX then.
So pofa can't arrest Beastly for using APTX on satou in the same phase. But if pofa arrest beastly for killing someone on night 1 etc. then Beastly will be arrested and the APTX won't be used and confiscated in that case.

4) For some reason, the previous iteration of the rules said that Lovers cannot be disguised as.  I didn't see how that was necessary, so.

I dunno either! Seems like silly giri was on the move again! Well, I never said there aren't any mistakes in my rule list version XD
So yeah, disguised players can be also lovers D: Never wanted it otherwise actually D:

- Every player can PM a "Will" to the GM. It can be a letter, a tape or just an item that you'll drop. This Will will be shown in case you're lynched. You can also tell the GM the way you want to die (in case you prefer to burn instead of being hanged etc.)

imo, the way people are killed should go to the BO, and in case of lynchings maybe they can say how they react to bein lynched or somesuch, but short of someone committing suicide due to a lover, I don't think it should really be up to the person that much.

The way you want to die was meant for the lynching. (but silly giri was on the move again? XD) And yes, BO can decide how the target could die (but GM doesn't have to follow imo XD)
I had that idea because when I was Vermouth and about to be lynched, I asked Sakina if I can die by fire (because Vermouth killed Jodies father and then burned the house down)


What about
- the bombing!
- poor lovers
- there were some other suggestions too somewhere in this thread.
- need to balance other stuffs?

You don't have to add them ;p

[Abs.]

Nice work abs.! 

Thanks luvey! 

Why can Lovers win when both are arrested? Or is that in case they are Bo/bo for example?
I don't know how they can win when they are town/BO and both are arrested D:

If they are clever enough to both be arrested and not lynched or killed, I suppose that counts as strategy?  In which case Lovers AND BO or Lovers AND Town win?

The leader ranking has nothing to do with the APTX ranking! In case there are not enough APTX, then the ranking of the listed BO roles will be used.

People were confused by that in the round I GMed. So maybe leaving it like that or if they make a ranking list, the APTX will be according to that list instead.

I decided to leave it how you had it, just in case the voted leader was a Lover.

The Leader can decide to give the Black Suitcase to any member during the game. He/she can also list substitutes for the Suitcase in case the target(s) is/are killed during the day.

Clarify if the leader has to give out the Case to himself too or not (in case the BO forgets to give it to someone *cough*)
So, in case the leader forgets to Pm the Gm with a list, if the leader got the Case or not. So whether the case can be used for that one phase or not.

Okay.

* Spy
- Role with that action: Irish
- Irish chooses a list of players not in the BO equal to 1/3 of the number of town players (= number of APTX). Of these, the GM picks a random one and sends the name of the role to Irish. Irish will not know from which of the players he just learned the role
- He will only know there is a "Shinichi" in the list of 5 players (= 14-16 town players), but not which one of these 5 players really is Shinichi
- This does not reveal if someone is 1412, Irish will just get the disguised role

Well, the number of town players in the list is the same number of APTX. But if there would be a game with a low number of players, then I think there should be a minimum of Town players Irish has to pick from? Since with just 3 townroles it's easier to know. So a minimum of 4 or 5 maybe?
Not sure if this is needed tho.

I'll take a look at this.

* Heal
- Role with that action: Araide
- Can use Heal on any player, including himself.
- The healed player doesn't die because of Killing or Sniping. Can't heal APTX or a wounded person or an injured Ran.
- If there is a attack that was successfully healed, everyone involved (also protectors (Ran, Makoto) and Okiya) will NOT know the attackers identity
- The attacker will know that the target was Healed/First Aided, but not from whom and if there were any protectors involved.
- Watch protection > Protect > Heal > First Aid: see under rules

I agree that healing doesn't reveal the identity. but the part:
- If there is a attack that was successfully healed, everyone involved (also protectors (Ran, Makoto) and Okiya) will NOT know the attackers identity

Sounds strange since protecting > healing. So in case Protectors are involved then the protect will take effect before Healing anyway. So the Identity of the attacker will be know to the protector and the target. But what about araide that also healed the target?

It logical that Okiya doesn't get to know the attackers identity. But will Okiya know that araide healed the same target and succeed? Or if it was a protector instead?

I'll also take a look at this.

* Discombobulate
- Roles with that action: Eisuke, Vodka
- People that were discombobulated will fail with their night action on the same night.
- This doesn't affect Day actions.
- The people discombobulated will get a PM from the GM that their night action failed. They will only get a notice in case they used a night action. If they have a night action and didn't use it or have a day action or no active action, they won't know that they were discombobulated via PM.
- The Night action Arrest can't be discombobulated in any way. All other night actions can be discombobulated. You can also discombobulate the interrogation/investigation that the player was able to do through the Bow-tie from Agasa. Protection from the tranquilizer watch can be discombobulated too. You can also discombobulate the "fake investigations" that are possible through the Black Suitcase.
- Travel can be discombobulated!
- Discombobulation can prevent the BO from killing or sniping someone.
- If a discombobulated action is investigated, then the action will be shown as "false", because the action wasn't done in the end.
- May NOT discombobulate themselves, because it will discombobulate the GM.
- Vodka: If the BO Leader commands Vodka to kill his lover, Vodka MAY discombobulate the Leader to prevent this action.  This case is the ONLY override to a BO Leader's order.  Beware: The Leader will be notified that he was discombobulated, and will know that Vodka was the only one who could have done it.

If Eisuke discombobulate the leader, will an order be "nullified"?
Or just in case a BO lover was ordered to kill his lover (Vermouth to kill Satou for example) and the BO leader was discombobulated be Eisuke, then the killing is also hindered or not?

No, only Vodka can discombobulate the Leader's order for Vodka to kill his Lover.

* Protection Charm
- Role with that action: Kazuha
- Can give a person the Protection Charm once per game. The next Day, the target will have his/her lynching votes reduced by 1 and be protected from APTX poisoning.
- The APTX will still be used up.  BO won’t know charm was in play.
- Can give charm to herself.
- Not subject to discombobulation.
- Works like Agasa’s gadgets: Kazuha won't know the identity of the one who received the Charm. The one who got the Charm will just know that Kazuha gave it to him/her, not the identity of the player.

If it's just once per game than Kazuha will be even more useless than Ran and her suicide before. The player will probably hold back and Kazuha using her charm will be as rare as arresting before.
And she will have a action that can be used just once. She doesn't have any other actions after that and is pretty much a commoner then. She doesn't get any infos either. (she didn't get any before either, but she could at least use her charm and maybe prove her own role with that if she wanted)

Well, I guess Kazuha will have to hope Sonoko chooses her to be her best friend... Oh wait.  LOL.  Two useless, suspicious townies!  Haha!  I like it, so I'm keeping it like that. 

Example 2: (Day 3)
Beastly) APTX pofa = Satou.
pofa) Arrest Beastly for using APTX on pofa on Day 3.
Result: pofa arrests Beastly.  Beastly does not get to use APTX on pofa.  APTX is confiscated. (See APTX under Day actions)

because at the time of the arrest, the crime hasn't happened. Imo, you should only be able to arrest on actions that have been done successfully, not actions that are happening in the same phase as you're performing the arrest. But, if there's already rules that go with this, *shrug*

You can't arrest someone for a crime that wasn't done yet. So you can't arrest Beastly on the same day he uses APTX.
There was a question about that before, but I didn't add it to the rules afterward D:

The example was like that:
Night2 -
Vodka kills Pofa.
Pofa arrest Vodka on night 2 for killing pofa.

So, if you can arrest someone for a crime that happens in the same phase, it would be like that:
Vodka ties to kill Pofa. But Pofa arrest Vodka for killing pofa on night 2. So, Vodka get's arrested, but Pofa didn't die. So Vodka didn't do that crime actually, so he was arrested falsely. But if Vodka isn't arrested, then Pofa dies and he actually did the crime..... paradox?! D:

So I decided to not let that happen and you can't arrest someone for a crime that's done in the same phase (was asked when I was GMing round 9, but forgot to change that in the rules D:)

But Pofa can arrest Vodka for intimidating Sherry on day 1 for example. Then Vodka get's arrested and Pofa will stay alive.

Same goes for APTX then.
So pofa can't arrest Beastly for using APTX on satou in the same phase. But if pofa arrest beastly for killing someone on night 1 etc. then Beastly will be arrested and the APTX won't be used and confiscated in that case.

Yup, Akonyl pointed this out.  The previous version actually states that the crime CAN be done in the same phase, so I was going with that.  It's changed now.  I'll post the changed version later, after I have considered the other stuff in your post.

- Every player can PM a "Will" to the GM. It can be a letter, a tape or just an item that you'll drop. This Will will be shown in case you're lynched. You can also tell the GM the way you want to die (in case you prefer to burn instead of being hanged etc.)

imo, the way people are killed should go to the BO, and in case of lynchings maybe they can say how they react to bein lynched or somesuch, but short of someone committing suicide due to a lover, I don't think it should really be up to the person that much.

The way you want to die was meant for the lynching. (but silly giri was on the move again? XD) And yes, BO can decide how the target could die (but GM doesn't have to follow imo XD)
I had that idea because when I was Vermouth and about to be lynched, I asked Sakina if I can die by fire (because Vermouth killed Jodies father and then burned the house down)

Also has been pointed out by Akonyl, and addressed. 

What about
- the bombing!
- poor lovers
- there were some other suggestions too somewhere in this thread.
- need to balance other stuffs?

You don't have to add them ;p

This is my reaction to the bombing idea:    D: D: D: D: D:
I'll look at some of the other suggestions.  Maybe. 

[pofa]

By the way, in case Abs.'s round goes quicker than planned I need a standby GM for me in the round after Abs.'s. :V

I've been thinking of GMing a game recently, the only downside to me GMing is that there isn't much leeway I can give in when Ithe pahses would start (as it'd basically have to be between 7-9 eastern).

This would be a perfect time for me, which is all that really matters. /hint-->Abs.

[Kleene Onigiri]

Why can Lovers win when both are arrested? Or is that in case they are Bo/bo for example?
I don't know how they can win when they are town/BO and both are arrested D:

If they are clever enough to both be arrested and not lynched or killed, I suppose that counts as strategy?  In which case Lovers AND BO or Lovers AND Town win?

D:
A prison love story? I like that! XD

The leader ranking has nothing to do with the APTX ranking! In case there are not enough APTX, then the ranking of the listed BO roles will be used.

People were confused by that in the round I GMed. So maybe leaving it like that or if they make a ranking list, the APTX will be according to that list instead.

I decided to leave it how you had it, just in case the voted leader was a Lover.

Alright! That's also a reason why I did it like that for the APTX.

* Discombobulate
- Roles with that action: Eisuke, Vodka
- People that were discombobulated will fail with their night action on the same night.
- This doesn't affect Day actions.
- The people discombobulated will get a PM from the GM that their night action failed. They will only get a notice in case they used a night action. If they have a night action and didn't use it or have a day action or no active action, they won't know that they were discombobulated via PM.
- The Night action Arrest can't be discombobulated in any way. All other night actions can be discombobulated. You can also discombobulate the interrogation/investigation that the player was able to do through the Bow-tie from Agasa. Protection from the tranquilizer watch can be discombobulated too. You can also discombobulate the "fake investigations" that are possible through the Black Suitcase.
- Travel can be discombobulated!
- Discombobulation can prevent the BO from killing or sniping someone.
- If a discombobulated action is investigated, then the action will be shown as "false", because the action wasn't done in the end.
- May NOT discombobulate themselves, because it will discombobulate the GM.
- Vodka: If the BO Leader commands Vodka to kill his lover, Vodka MAY discombobulate the Leader to prevent this action.  This case is the ONLY override to a BO Leader's order.  Beware: The Leader will be notified that he was discombobulated, and will know that Vodka was the only one who could have done it.

If Eisuke discombobulate the leader, will an order be "nullified"?
Or just in case a BO lover was ordered to kill his lover (Vermouth to kill Satou for example) and the BO leader was discombobulated be Eisuke, then the killing is also hindered or not?

No, only Vodka can discombobulate the Leader's order for Vodka to kill his Lover.

Alright!

* Protection Charm
- Role with that action: Kazuha
- Can give a person the Protection Charm once per game. The next Day, the target will have his/her lynching votes reduced by 1 and be protected from APTX poisoning.
- The APTX will still be used up.  BO won’t know charm was in play.
- Can give charm to herself.
- Not subject to discombobulation.
- Works like Agasa’s gadgets: Kazuha won't know the identity of the one who received the Charm. The one who got the Charm will just know that Kazuha gave it to him/her, not the identity of the player.

If it's just once per game than Kazuha will be even more useless than Ran and her suicide before. The player will probably hold back and Kazuha using her charm will be as rare as arresting before.
And she will have a action that can be used just once. She doesn't have any other actions after that and is pretty much a commoner then. She doesn't get any infos either. (she didn't get any before either, but she could at least use her charm and maybe prove her own role with that if she wanted)

Well, I guess Kazuha will have to hope Sonoko chooses her to be her best friend... Oh wait.  LOL.  Two useless, suspicious townies!  Haha!  I like it, so I'm keeping it like that.   :P

How mean D: Next time I GM you'll end up as Kazuha as punishment!!! jk ;p
Still, separating the effects in 2 charms is a option too ;p

Example 2: (Day 3)
Beastly) APTX pofa = Satou.
pofa) Arrest Beastly for using APTX on pofa on Day 3.
Result: pofa arrests Beastly.  Beastly does not get to use APTX on pofa.  APTX is confiscated. (See APTX under Day actions)

because at the time of the arrest, the crime hasn't happened. Imo, you should only be able to arrest on actions that have been done successfully, not actions that are happening in the same phase as you're performing the arrest. But, if there's already rules that go with this, *shrug*

You can't arrest someone for a crime that wasn't done yet. So you can't arrest Beastly on the same day he uses APTX.
There was a question about that before, but I didn't add it to the rules afterward D:

The example was like that:
Night2 -
Vodka kills Pofa.
Pofa arrest Vodka on night 2 for killing pofa.

So, if you can arrest someone for a crime that happens in the same phase, it would be like that:
Vodka ties to kill Pofa. But Pofa arrest Vodka for killing pofa on night 2. So, Vodka get's arrested, but Pofa didn't die. So Vodka didn't do that crime actually, so he was arrested falsely. But if Vodka isn't arrested, then Pofa dies and he actually did the crime..... paradox?! D:

So I decided to not let that happen and you can't arrest someone for a crime that's done in the same phase (was asked when I was GMing round 9, but forgot to change that in the rules D:)

But Pofa can arrest Vodka for intimidating Sherry on day 1 for example. Then Vodka get's arrested and Pofa will stay alive.

Same goes for APTX then.
So pofa can't arrest Beastly for using APTX on satou in the same phase. But if pofa arrest beastly for killing someone on night 1 etc. then Beastly will be arrested and the APTX won't be used and confiscated in that case.

Yup, Akonyl pointed this out.  The previous version actually states that the crime CAN be done in the same phase, so I was going with that.  It's changed now.  I'll post the changed version later, after I have considered the other stuff in your post.

I know that a-chan pointed it out 
Just saying that I made a mistake with the old rule ;p

- Every player can PM a "Will" to the GM. It can be a letter, a tape or just an item that you'll drop. This Will will be shown in case you're lynched. You can also tell the GM the way you want to die (in case you prefer to burn instead of being hanged etc.)

imo, the way people are killed should go to the BO, and in case of lynchings maybe they can say how they react to bein lynched or somesuch, but short of someone committing suicide due to a lover, I don't think it should really be up to the person that much.

The way you want to die was meant for the lynching. (but silly giri was on the move again? XD) And yes, BO can decide how the target could die (but GM doesn't have to follow imo XD)
I had that idea because when I was Vermouth and about to be lynched, I asked Sakina if I can die by fire (because Vermouth killed Jodies father and then burned the house down)

Also has been pointed out by Akonyl, and addressed.   :D

Yeah ;p Just pointing out my uselessness again D: well, more like I didn't put in the info that it's for lynching mainly ;p

What about
- the bombing!
- poor lovers
- there were some other suggestions too somewhere in this thread.
- need to balance other stuffs?

You don't have to add them ;p

This is my reaction to the bombing idea:    D: D: D: D: D:
I'll look at some of the other suggestions.  Maybe.   :P

I take D: as a yes :3

[Grawwbear]

Silly Giri!

Fff now I have to wait till all the changes made to the new rules are finalized for Abs.'s round :V Well, I guess that's the only thing I have to worry about, then... I can work on everything else 8D

[Kleene Onigiri]

Silly Giri!

Fff now I have to wait till all the changes made to the new rules are finalized for Abs.'s round :V Well, I guess that's the only thing I have to worry about, then... I can work on everything else 8D

You can join me and annoy abs. with new rules/roles/abilities XD

[Grawwbear]

Silly Giri. D: I'm still working on my round-that-I-might-possibly-GM-in-the-near-future! :<

[Beastly]

I wanna scrap the 2 Lovers, the town is having a hard time getting the B.Os btw, CTu you forgot something to post 

[Kleene Onigiri]

I wanna scrap the 2 Lovers, the town is having a hard time getting the B.Os btw, CTu you forgot something to post 

If you think that then PM Ctu instead D:
Maybe Ctu doesn't read that topic at the moment.

[Abs.]

I wanna scrap the 2 Lovers, the town is having a hard time getting the B.Os

So limit of one pair of Lovers per game?

[Kleene Onigiri]

I wanna scrap the 2 Lovers, the town is having a hard time getting the B.Os

So limit of one pair of Lovers per game?

Depends. If there are a lot of people playing then 2 lover pairs aren't bad. As long as the BO isn't involved in more that 1 lover pair (whether it's BO/BO or BO/town)

[Grawwbear]

I wanna scrap the 2 Lovers, the town is having a hard time getting the B.Os

So limit of one pair of Lovers per game?

I think I like what Ctu had with the lovers this game. I think that unless the number of players exceed 20, we should stick to one pair of Lovers.

[pofa]

Well, I guess Kazuha will have to hope Sonoko chooses her to be her best friend... Oh wait.  LOL.  Two useless, suspicious townies!  Haha!  I like it, so I'm keeping it like that. 

In that case, would you consider making Protection Charm a day action? That way, Kazuha would have a better idea of who needed it and a better chance of not wasting it.