Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 888-890

Forum reserved for discussing specific points of the story—mostly from the manga. Be warned, these discussions will be current with the manga and will spoil many plot lines for anime-centric fans.
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PhantomWriter
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 888-?

Post by PhantomWriter »

Xenita00 wrote:
Spoiler:
His reaction on "Zero" bothers me.
I was thinking:
1. "Zero" is like "Sera" and that could mean that he meets Sera and that may be the middle brother, also said that nicknames are made by children and if he were his brother in infancy had spent time together and Sera could have put this nickname. But the problem is that I doubt Bourboun want to kill his brother. És illogical. Theory deleted.
2. "Zero" could be the nickname given to him by Date Wataru when he was alive and were partners in the training of police officers. But when he says that nicknames are made by children eliminates the theory.
3. If what he says after his reaction to "Zero" is a lie it could be the countdown to a bomb. But it would have reacted earlier, at the beginning of the countdown. Theory deleted.
4. If what he says after his reaction to "Zero" is a lie it could be someone in the elevator, Vermouth for example, and does not want discovered.
Conan knows something because at the end says "Could it be ...". He knows something that we have not been able to see. Uffff I do not understand, maybe it will be new information about the past of Amuro.
Several fans have made the connection between Gundam and this situation
Spoiler:
as one way of saying zero is "rei." As in, Amuro Rei = Amuro Ray, because Gosho loves his references.
As for those last two theories you talk about, I'm curious.
Spoiler:
The third theory is about a bomb, though that is interesting when one considers what happened during the Clash of Red and Black with that hospital and bombs. After all, the Organization sent all those little plastic bombs into the hospital, Camel's death was feigned with one of those plastic bombs, Kusuda used fake plastic bombs hidden under his brace to get out of the hospital, and Shuichi's body was supposedly blown up by Kir using one of those bombs. Perhaps there's a connection after all?

The fourth theory makes me curious as well. What would Conan know that would make him think that "zero" would result in a "Could it be..." thought bubble? And where did he find that information?
As for the translation, I have some questions about the connotations of that explanation of zero.
Spoiler:
The idea that he can be seen through and there's nothing there strikes me as a bit on the weird side. Is the idea that nobody can figure him out, like he's invisible or a black hole? Or is the idea that he's transparent in his motives and that his disguise is seen through easily, that there's nothing substantial to whatever identity in question he has? (Is he alluding to Conan figuring out he's Bourbon?) Maybe it's his ability to otherwise blend seamlessly in unless with a truly worthy opponent, that people cannot see past the disguise?

Hell, perhaps he's a deep cover double agent, especially given some of the alcohol jokes in the series? (Rye and Vermouth mixed together in a cocktail make a Manhattan, whereas both characters with those codenames show up in the NYC arc, for example. Mix together Rye and Bourbon, plus some Tabasco sauce (in this case for allusions, a bomb) and you get a Hellfire. Incidentally, mix Tabasco sauce with Tequilla and you get a shooter called TNT, much like how Tequila was blown up with a bomb. Bourbon often replaces Rye in more modern cocktails and Rye was a double agent...
That reminds me, I really need to make that topic regarding alcohol references soon. ;D
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 888-?

Post by ShinRan4ver »

PhantomWriter wrote:I'll readily admit I'm excited for this arc, all things considered. Seems the great detective has been none too subtle and it's about to bite him in the butt...
He had been "none to subtle" in the Vermouth Arc as well, turned out just alright. It is all part of the plan.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 888-?

Post by k11chi »

Amuro was such a boss this chapter, "you're amazing..." and then Conan is like wtf?
PhantomWriter wrote:
Xenita00 wrote:
Spoiler:
His reaction on "Zero" bothers me.
I was thinking:
1. "Zero" is like "Sera" and that could mean that he meets Sera and that may be the middle brother, also said that nicknames are made by children and if he were his brother in infancy had spent time together and Sera could have put this nickname. But the problem is that I doubt Bourboun want to kill his brother. És illogical. Theory deleted.
2. "Zero" could be the nickname given to him by Date Wataru when he was alive and were partners in the training of police officers. But when he says that nicknames are made by children eliminates the theory.
3. If what he says after his reaction to "Zero" is a lie it could be the countdown to a bomb. But it would have reacted earlier, at the beginning of the countdown. Theory deleted.
4. If what he says after his reaction to "Zero" is a lie it could be someone in the elevator, Vermouth for example, and does not want discovered.
Conan knows something because at the end says "Could it be ...". He knows something that we have not been able to see. Uffff I do not understand, maybe it will be new information about the past of Amuro.
Several fans have made the connection between Gundam and this situation
Spoiler:
as one way of saying zero is "rei." As in, Amuro Rei = Amuro Ray, because Gosho loves his references.
As for those last two theories you talk about, I'm curious.
Spoiler:
The third theory is about a bomb, though that is interesting when one considers what happened during the Clash of Red and Black with that hospital and bombs. After all, the Organization sent all those little plastic bombs into the hospital, Camel's death was feigned with one of those plastic bombs, Kusuda used fake plastic bombs hidden under his brace to get out of the hospital, and Shuichi's body was supposedly blown up by Kir using one of those bombs. Perhaps there's a connection after all?

The fourth theory makes me curious as well. What would Conan know that would make him think that "zero" would result in a "Could it be..." thought bubble? And where did he find that information?
As for the translation, I have some questions about the connotations of that explanation of zero.
Spoiler:
The idea that he can be seen through and there's nothing there strikes me as a bit on the weird side. Is the idea that nobody can figure him out, like he's invisible or a black hole? Or is the idea that he's transparent in his motives and that his disguise is seen through easily, that there's nothing substantial to whatever identity in question he has? (Is he alluding to Conan figuring out he's Bourbon?) Maybe it's his ability to otherwise blend seamlessly in unless with a truly worthy opponent, that people cannot see past the disguise?

Hell, perhaps he's a deep cover double agent, especially given some of the alcohol jokes in the series? (Rye and Vermouth mixed together in a cocktail make a Manhattan, whereas both characters with those codenames show up in the NYC arc, for example. Mix together Rye and Bourbon, plus some Tabasco sauce (in this case for allusions, a bomb) and you get a Hellfire. Incidentally, mix Tabasco sauce with Tequilla and you get a shooter called TNT, much like how Tequila was blown up with a bomb. Bourbon often replaces Rye in more modern cocktails and Rye was a double agent...
That reminds me, I really need to make that topic regarding alcohol references soon. ;D
It's not that he is seen through easily but that he was, and I think the current Amuro is like trying to act as an opposite of his past self, probably because of Date or his arm injury something that made him change.
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PhantomWriter
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 888-?

Post by PhantomWriter »

ShinRan4ver wrote:
PhantomWriter wrote:I'll readily admit I'm excited for this arc, all things considered. Seems the great detective has been none too subtle and it's about to bite him in the butt...
He had been "none to subtle" in the Vermouth Arc as well, turned out just alright. It is all part of the plan.
Vermouth was still a somewhat safe distance away (even with the red herring about Jodie being Vermouth and red herring about Shuichi), as opposed to an Organization member hanging around the Mouri Detective Agency all the time. Conan is playing with fire right now.

Shuichi warned him there would be consequences to his actions that wouldn't only affect Conan himself, back in the Clash of Red and Black. "Kid... Are you ready? Whether you like it or not... By this action, your face will be known to them... As a dog who helped us FBI... If that happens the resulting fire spark won't just stop with you..." -File 598, pages 8 and 9. Conan promptly dismisses his concerns, which is worrying.

It's also worrying when I look back at Eisuke's explanation for how he figured out Conan was "Sleeping Kogoro" and how he had half a theory about Conan being Shinichi. He barely had any resources and figured it out. Bourbon, who's much more experienced and has more resources, should have figured it out by now.

I'm just saying that, even if this is a part of some plan, Conan's luck's going to run out one of these days and the resulting firestorm will be pretty damn bad. They barely made it out of the Bell Tree train mess without casualties and, even then, it managed to set up part of this current situation (Akai revealing himself when giving KID an out is why Amuro's digging around again in regard to the situation surrounding Akai's death, including Kusuda; because Conan was involved in the Clash of Red and Black and is shielding Akai by giving him residence in the Kudou house, he's also in danger even if he wasn't Kudou and wasn't a pain in the Org's side in his own right). I'm actually rooting for Bourbon a bit at this point, just to give Conan consequences for his extreme hubris and recklessness.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 888-?

Post by pikacutie25 »

PhantomWriter wrote:
ShinRan4ver wrote:
PhantomWriter wrote:I'll readily admit I'm excited for this arc, all things considered. Seems the great detective has been none too subtle and it's about to bite him in the butt...
He had been "none to subtle" in the Vermouth Arc as well, turned out just alright. It is all part of the plan.
Vermouth was still a somewhat safe distance away (even with the red herring about Jodie being Vermouth and red herring about Shuichi), as opposed to an Organization member hanging around the Mouri Detective Agency all the time. Conan is playing with fire right now.

Shuichi warned him there would be consequences to his actions that wouldn't only affect Conan himself, back in the Clash of Red and Black. "Kid... Are you ready? Whether you like it or not... By this action, your face will be known to them... As a dog who helped us FBI... If that happens the resulting fire spark won't just stop with you..." -File 598, pages 8 and 9. Conan promptly dismisses his concerns, which is worrying.

It's also worrying when I look back at Eisuke's explanation for how he figured out Conan was "Sleeping Kogoro" and how he had half a theory about Conan being Shinichi. He barely had any resources and figured it out. Bourbon, who's much more experienced and has more resources, should have figured it out by now.

I'm just saying that, even if this is a part of some plan, Conan's luck's going to run out one of these days and the resulting firestorm will be pretty damn bad. They barely made it out of the Bell Tree train mess without casualties and, even then, it managed to set up part of this current situation (Akai revealing himself when giving KID an out is why Amuro's digging around again in regard to the situation surrounding Akai's death, including Kusuda; because Conan was involved in the Clash of Red and Black and is shielding Akai by giving him residence in the Kudou house, he's also in danger even if he wasn't Kudou and wasn't a pain in the Org's side in his own right).
Very good points.
PhantomWriter wrote:I'm actually rooting for Bourbon a bit at this point, just to give Conan consequences for his extreme hubris and recklessness.
I actually totally agree with you. Seeing him squirm would actually probably be pretty entertaining. :P And maybe we'll advance even further than before with the plot!
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 888-?

Post by Fennec »

Heads-up: the chapter's available in the spoiler chat.

The timing of Conan's "He... could it be..." thought worries me. Amuro had just made the comment about how appendicitis can be dangerous if you just let it slide. At this point it's obvious Amuro's suspicious of Conan, even from his limited viewpoint in comparison to the readers. Knowing that, it almost sounds like it could be a threat discreetly directed to Conan: "Watch out, or we'll kill Eri." Maybe I'm reading too much into it, but based on his reaction I'm wondering if Conan is possibly thinking the same thing.

Amuro might have said it as a test, to gauge Conan's reactions. After all, a normal person wouldn't see anything malicious in that statement. It sounds like a friendly warning. But when you know the person saying it is a BO member... that's another story. Additionally, Amuro seems fond of gauging people's reactions to gather information. He's already done it once this chapter, and he also used the Scar Akai guise to determine if Akai was alive or not (or at least as far as the FBI knew). Conan's reaction to the line could make or break his disguise. Right now, I feel like the case will proceed like normal from here, and then at the end there'll be some exposition on Conan's part where he thinks over how the line was a test, and he probably would have failed if not for the convenient timing of the murder.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 888-?

Post by The_evilbit »

Fennec wrote:Heads-up: the chapter's available in the spoiler chat.

The timing of Conan's "He... could it be..." thought worries me. Amuro had just made the comment about how appendicitis can be dangerous if you just let it slide. At this point it's obvious Amuro's suspicious of Conan, even from his limited viewpoint in comparison to the readers. Knowing that, it almost sounds like it could be a threat discreetly directed to Conan: "Watch out, or we'll kill Eri." Maybe I'm reading too much into it, but based on his reaction I'm wondering if Conan is possibly thinking the same thing.

Amuro might have said it as a test, to gauge Conan's reactions. After all, a normal person wouldn't see anything malicious in that statement. It sounds like a friendly warning. But when you know the person saying it is a BO member... that's another story. Additionally, Amuro seems fond of gauging people's reactions to gather information. He's already done it once this chapter, and he also used the Scar Akai guise to determine if Akai was alive or not (or at least as far as the FBI knew). Conan's reaction to the line could make or break his disguise. Right now, I feel like the case will proceed like normal from here, and then at the end there'll be some exposition on Conan's part where he thinks over how the line was a test, and he probably would have failed if not for the convenient timing of the murder.
Spoiler:
I agree the case will go on as normal, or rather we know sleeping Kogoro will not be making an appearance due to Bourbon watching Conan like a hawk. Bourbon most likely won't be putting too much input into the case either, as previously illustrated with past characters having done the same to Conan when suspicious, and force his hand. I agree to the meat as far as plot advancement won't really occur until the end. I just hope this isn't it for awhile and we go back to filler for another couple months. To borrow an internet meme, "Shots fired". It seems silly to have Bourbon start to play a game of mental chess with Conan, only to go to a DB chapter arc.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 888-?

Post by Chekhov MacGuffin »

Not sure if anyone wrote this already, but the nickname zero is another Gundam reference (although there may be more meaning to it than just that.)

Zero = Rei which sounds like Ray. Amuro Ray.

This is probably the childhood nickname Gosho mentioned in the January interview. Unless Amuro was childhood friends with Date, then it is unlikely Date gave him this nickname.
Spoiler: interview reminders
Gosho declined to answer if Amuro's name is an alias. Amuro does have a childhood nickname that will appear. (Source 1,2,5,6,7)
Amuro's dark skin color has a meaning (Source 2,5,6,7) Gosho declined to say whether Amuro's hair and skin color is natural,(Source 1,5,6) but mentioned his current hair color is supposed to be brown, not white. (Source 6)
Amuro’s "profile" is a secret. (Source 6,7)
Gosho gave a non-answer about Amuro's weaknesses: "I also haven’t decided on any weaknesses or dislikes. I mean, you wouldn’t like it if I said that he dislikes nattō, right? (laughs)” (Source 2,5,6,7)
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 888-?

Post by kkuuddoo »

hasn't any one seen the new chapter ?
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 888-?

Post by AICHAN »

kkuuddoo wrote:hasn't any one seen the new chapter ?
Lol we saw the spoilers,but I guess people are waiting for a good translation.
But the spoiler box was full of members today,since we saw
Spoiler:
little Amuro talking to Ai's mother...That would explain why he said Ai looks like her mother back in the MT cases.Apparently on the new file Amuro used to see Elena whenever he was wonded...And she told him to stop fighting,and that she won't be there anymore.It seems like Amuro was really close to her,or at least he appreciated her.Seems like he was bullied by other kids and she was there for him.
So I'm wondering if Amuro refused to kill Sherry because he was close to Elena.
Btw little Amuro is so cute ^^
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 888-?

Post by kkuuddoo »

He is indeed adorable
I was so excited for this file and am sure not disappointed ,,,, I am so EXCITED for everything
I will wait for the translation
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 888-?

Post by AICHAN »

Yeah I'm excited too...I just hope it's not Vermouth in deguise,that would be so lame.
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 888-?

Post by k11chi »

That made me think that maybe Vermouth was a scientist or something.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 888-?

Post by PhantomWriter »

Well, kkuuddoo, the C-Box is more for brainstorming and such, so people tend to hang out there just after a file comes out. The forums are much more for after the embers have cooled, when people have formulated their theories based on more than just what has been revealed in a new file plus random ideas tossed out to generate more ideas. Or perhaps that's just my observations of the patterns of posting.

Still, aside from the obvious statement that little Amuro is adorable, I'm more inclined to wait until we have more information and I'm more inclined to go back through files where Elena is mentioned.
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kkuuddoo

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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 888-?

Post by kkuuddoo »

well I don't know where this c box thing and I think i previously tried to connect in dctp chat thing but it wouldn't let me
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