Chekhov's theories about the plot

[Chekhov MacGuffin]

Well the only thing that confuses me is, if Okiya is Akai, his reasons for going to that department store in the first place don't exactly match up. He went to the vendor of that hat with the specific symbol to, presumably, ask about the man who bought it. He had no idea he would run into Scar Akai, let alone be trapped on the floor with him. So its safe to assume that he went their to ask about the buyer of the hat. You could also assume that he knew about Scar Akai's existence before even seeing him or else he would have no reason to really ask about the buyer of the hat. So would he really go to the place selling that hat to ask if the person looked like Scar Akai when it seems likely he already knew that?

Just a side note before I forget: Isn't it  possible (this is all assuming that Okiya is Akai) that Okiya wrote that message on Jodie's coaster? She would assume it was Akai since..well thats what she wants to believe

Okiya's intention may have been to follow Jodie. We know from his own admission he went to the bank, presumably because he saw Scar Akai there from the news report. The bank and the dept store are nearly (or are) directly adjacent. If Okiya saw Jodie, he would likely follow wondering what brings her to this place where Scar Akai showed up with a black hat and Camel of all people.

As for the coaster, Okiya or Scar Akai could have written the message. I have heard good reasons for why both might so I have avoided basing any conclusions one of them in particular leaving it, but I personally suspect Okiya was the one.

[sonoci]

There's something I just came across that I wonder if/where you've speculated on, Chek. (since you have a lot of theories and I've actually read quite a bit of them but don't recall this tidbit)

In file 327, James refers to Conan as "Cool Guy". The only reason this bothers me is that Gosho took the time to have Jodie explain in the Halloween case that "Cool Guy" was a strange thing to call Conan since he's a kid.

So I guess the short of it is, I'm wondering if you've mentioned it, 'cause I'd like to read a theory behind that  It intrigues me

[User 4869]

At first, even Jodie refer to Conan as Cool "Guy". But she change it in to "Kid" in every time she ever call him later. Since Jodie is in league with James. I found nothing surprise.

[sonoci]

At first, even Jodie refer to Conan as Cool "Guy".

Just curious, do you know when that happened exactly? I'll probably look myself, just wondering if you know an exact place to look

[unclesporkums]

I believe it's near the end of file 272 in volume 27 or in the anime, it's episode 226. Either way, it's when Conan is walking away and she's thinking "Bye bye, Cool Guy."

[Chekhov MacGuffin]

There's something I just came across that I wonder if/where you've speculated on, Chek. (since you have a lot of theories and I've actually read quite a bit of them but don't recall this tidbit)

In file 327, James refers to Conan as "Cool Guy". The only reason this bothers me is that Gosho took the time to have Jodie explain in the Halloween case that "Cool Guy" was a strange thing to call Conan since he's a kid.

So I guess the short of it is, I'm wondering if you've mentioned it, 'cause I'd like to read a theory behind that  :D It intrigues me

Red Messaged

Jodie called Conan cool guy the first time they met, so V27-9, 272. For both James and Jodie, they initially called him that because of what was written on Vermouth's picture, which the FBI copied before Jodie's first appearance chronologically speaking. All the Vermouth's office scenes seem to not be on the same timeline as the chapters they are contained in, based on the evidence.

[sonoci]

There's something I just came across that I wonder if/where you've speculated on, Chek. (since you have a lot of theories and I've actually read quite a bit of them but don't recall this tidbit)

In file 327, James refers to Conan as "Cool Guy". The only reason this bothers me is that Gosho took the time to have Jodie explain in the Halloween case that "Cool Guy" was a strange thing to call Conan since he's a kid.

So I guess the short of it is, I'm wondering if you've mentioned it, 'cause I'd like to read a theory behind that  :D It intrigues me

Red Messaged

Jodie called Conan cool guy the first time they met, so V27-9, 272. For both James and Jodie, they initially called him that because of what was written on Vermouth's picture, which the FBI copied before Jodie's first appearance chronologically speaking. All the Vermouth's office scenes seem to not be on the same timeline as the chapters they are contained in, based on the evidence.

Ah, I see.  Thanks for clearing that up 

[sstimson]

Also not talked about but during the bus highjacking case, Jodie, Akai, and Vermouth saw Conan in action and detecting with out anyone to hide behind. Conan in resolving that case show the FBI a glimpse of his true self. He in that case did not hide behind Asaga who was there. It was clear and without question, that he was running the stop the bus written on a bomb. The question I now have is based on that glimpse, was that enough for the BO vermouth and the FBI to start fitting the pieces together?

[User 4869]

Vermouth know Conan is Shinichi before get on the bus as Araide or she won't shield him form gun.
FBI (Jodie) already interest in Conan, because the event that Chekhov mentions (game center case) came before this case, and Jodie already call Conan "Cool guy/Kid by then"

But if you talk about knowing Conan is Shinichi, Jodie never figured it out, or she won't ask Vermouth about calling Conan "Guy" in the full moon case.

[sstimson]

Vermouth know Conan is Shinichi before get on the bus as Araide or she won't shield him form gun.
FBI (Jodie) already interest in Conan, because the event that Chekhov mentions (game center case) came before this case, and Jodie already call Conan "Cool guy/Kid by then"

But if you talk about knowing Conan is Shinichi, Jodie never figured it out, or she won't ask Vermouth about calling Conan "Guy" in the full moon case.

I think she did that for a different reason. Remember Jodie know that the picture of Shiho and Haibara is the same person. At the game case you mentioned she heard Ran and Sonoko talking about Shinichi. It would not be hard to put the two together. Also remember the bug Jodie planted. The listener would hear how Shinichi and Conan are one and the same.
It seem to me Jodie was indirectly doing two things. One, she was confirming that the Kids were at one time high school aged. Two, she was indirectly tell both Conan and Vermouth, that she also knows about Shiho and Shinichi being who there are. Her question was not really a question but a statement phased as a question. Also my point about the Bus case is this. At the game center he hide behind Sonoko, but at the Bus case he did not hide and thus all there saw a glimpse of his true self.

[User 4869]

Remember Jodie know that the picture of Shiho and Haibara is the same person.<<<<
In the full moon case, Jodie say"the girl (Haibara) that resemble the woman in the picture (Shiho)" She never state them as single person. Even Shuichi who met both Shiho and Haibara, did not conclude immediately that they are the same person.

And by seeing Conan's trueself. I saw nothing past recognize Conan as a smart kid. Remember. Jodie were at the stage play case (desperate revival) So she should fall in the same trap as Ran (Think Shinichi and Conan are separate person).
And don't use your point of "Ran always know Conan as Shinichi" as an argument.

About the bug planted. I remember only Shuichi and Vermouth, not Jodie.

she heard Ran and Sonoko talking about Shinichi<<<<
What did they talk, exactly? Both Ran and Sonoko don't know Conan's true identity. what can Jodie conclude from that?

[sstimson]

Remember Jodie know that the picture of Shiho and Haibara is the same person.<<<<
In the full moon case, Jodie say"the girl (Haibara) that resemble the woman in the picture (Shiho)" She never state them as single person. Even Shuichi who met both Shiho and Haibara, did not conclude immediately that they are the same person.

And by seeing Conan's trueself. I saw nothing past recognize Conan as a smart kid. Remember. Jodie were at the stage play case (desperate revival) So she should fall in the same trap as Ran (Think Shinichi and Conan are separate person).
And don't use your point of "Ran always know Conan as Shinichi" as an argument.

About the bug planted. I remember only Shuichi and Vermouth, not Jodie.

she heard Ran and Sonoko talking about Shinichi<<<<
What did they talk, exactly? Both Ran and Sonoko don't know Conan's true identity. what can Jodie conclude from that?

It called reading between the lines.

Full Moon Case

Chapter 434 Page 13 Akai comment - No one will believe the truth AND it is not yet time for me to face the brown haired girl
From that comment I get that Akai knows who the Brown Haired Girl is for real and her real age. Also note he is not explaining his comment, which means that Jodie also knows why. She does not ask what he means by his comment because she knows.
That should show both Akai and Jodie at least know that Haibara is really Shiho.

Page 435 Page 3 Ran is explaining to Sonoko why she got in Jodie's trunk. Note here Jodie's story is a cover story, not complete the real story. But my point is this. She has pictures of both Conan and Shinichi, like she also has pictures of both Shiho and Haibara. As she knows About Haibara and the possibility of shrinking bodies, think about the ways and thoughts of Conan during the Bus Highjack case. To a trainer officer, there are sure to seem to be more likely from an older person then just a kid,and after hearing about Shinichi, could easily put the two together and realize that Shinichi Disappeared because like Shiho, he shrunk. And later her actions show she respects Conans ideas, enough to drop what she is doing and follow Conan, more evidence she made the leap between knowing that Conan is Shinichi. After all why show that kind of respect to just a kid? Another major clue is her expression after Conan set the stage to get the police to check for a murder on page 8 of Chapter 271. That look is very telling. On Page 5 of chapter 272 look at where Jodie is. At this time she might even not be watching Sonoko, but Conan and again see through his trick. And she covers her tracks well as shown on page 17 of chapter 272. Another telling look is Chapter 339 Page 16. Here she acts like Conan does at times, giving out hints to help him on the right track and hinting about her being FBI.

As for the stage play case, remember that even before that case she saw pictures that Vermouth had and her notes. Also remember that unlike Ran, she is a trained officer and after Heiji trick of pretending to be Shinichi, she would smell a rat. She might realize that the Conan is really Haibara acting the part and that Conan is missing. She might realize that because of the fake Conan something is up. She is sure to check on when Sonoko and Kogorou started solving cases and notice the similarities between Kogorou and Sonoko deductions. Believe me, if you look for it all kind of hints are out there for the trained investigator.

As for the Bug as Jodie planted it, she might have a way to listen to it. Remember an earlier case where a bug was transmitted over a radio (Red Horse Case). Knowing how the bug worked would make it easy for her to listen in. Also not sure if the bug was placed yet or not, but at Chapter 341 page 3 again Conan is talking and Shinichi shrinking and he being him.

Ran and Sonoko  talking about Shinichi with Jodie nearby. I only give a few examples.
Chapter 270 Page 4, Chapter 272 Page 17(No question here), Chapter 338 Page 5(again no question), Chapter 340 Page 8(at least nearby), Chapter 426 Page 7. Also Jodie stop Ran from asking Conan for help. She knows Ran is smart enough to figure it out her self.

[Midi]

Hi all, I am finally coming out of lurk-dom in this fandom. I have two questions regarding the (brilliant!) expositions of facts that has been presented by Ms Chekhov.

1) Kaneshiro Genichirou is mentioned as a recurring character during the explanation of the B.O.'s presence in the Night Baron Virus killing case. (Vol 8 File 2-7), but I have not been able to find evidence to him appearing or being mentioned anywhere else. I am curious as to this as Ms Chekhov is usually very thorough.

2) An interview was mentioned with Gosho-sensei where he states that the organisations his two major protagonists in different manga are after (Shinichi's B.O., Kaito's criminal group) are two separate entities. I would very much like to be linked\see the origin of this, as while the fandom has more or less integrated the idea that they are one and the same, the DC manga has always made sure to present Kid arcs and Org arcs separately. Similarities in theme are there (I found myself nodding to each and every one of Chekhov's theories on the eternal-youth research, as even I had noted Shiho's presence on mermaid island and added it to the apotoxin and Vermouth's youth) with the Pandora, and 'Snake' can still be an alcohol if it refers to a Korean snake wine, but there is not enough solid information to seal the theory either way. This mentioned interview would determine it.

Thanks all!

[Chekhov MacGuffin]

1) Kaneshiro Genichirou is mentioned as a recurring character during the explanation of the B.O.'s presence in the Night Baron Virus killing case. (Vol 8 File 2-7), but I have not been able to find evidence to him appearing or being mentioned anywhere else. I am curious as to this as Ms Chekhov is usually very thorough.

Sorry, I forgot to remove that last reference to him when I overhauled the list. There is one Kaneshiro Genichirou from the Night Baron case, and then there is a Kaneshiro family with an identical last name spelling (金城) in the Servitor of Goosoh case. The Kaneshiro who appeared in that case was Kaneshiro Hyogo. It was brought up on the minor recurring characters wiki page that the two families may not be the same, as there was no proof for their connection other than identical last name spellings. Since there was no adequate counterclaim, I scrubbed the document of references to Kaneshiro recurring, but it seems I missed that one.

2) An interview was mentioned with Gosho-sensei where he states that the organisations his two major protagonists in different manga are after (Shinichi's B.O., Kaito's criminal group) are two separate entities. I would very much like to be linked\see the origin of this, as while the fandom has more or less integrated the idea that they are one and the same, the DC manga has always made sure to present Kid arcs and Org arcs separately. Similarities in theme are there (I found myself nodding to each and every one of Chekhov's theories on the eternal-youth research, as even I had noted Shiho's presence on mermaid island and added it to the apoptoxin and Vermouth's youth) with the Pandora, and 'Snake' can still be an alcohol if it refers to a Korean snake wine, but there is not enough solid information to seal the theory either way. This mentioned interview would determine it.

Thanks all!

I have been looking for that interview for a while too. This rumor in particular has been around for a very long while. (at least 2005!) Other rumors, like the boss's name has appeared one, were floating around long before the interviews were translated. Not all the interviews known to exist have been translated (http://www.detectiveconanworld.com/foru ... nterviews/). In any case, I have other reasons to think they aren't the same organization, based on comparing their behavior and structure so far.

[stella007]

I'm a fan of your theories so far. I think that your theories are right. Have you already a idea about the ending? Or do you have posted it and i missed it?  -.-