Chekhov's theories about the plot

[S.Vineyard]

Well, the slapping got a bit over the Top in Zeta, were everyone slapped everybody. (Even Bright^^)

Back to topic.

Am I a bit to optimistic about Ran or is my assumtion realistic?

[unclesporkums]

Am I a bit to optimistic about Ran or is my assumtion realistic?

I think it's possibly pretty darn realistic. After Chek schooled me about misinterpreting the suspicion theory, I agree with her that one might be coming in the future, and I'm hoping with you that Conan won't be able to get out of this one.

[S.Vineyard]

Thank you. I'm already waiting a decade for this moment.
And to make a final slap:  Have you also wanted to slap the makers of OP11 for a certain misleading scene?

[unclesporkums]

Have you also wanted to slap the makers of OP11 for a certain misleading scene?

I know you're probably asking Chek, but as for me, Ever since the anime went off the air in my country, I've only really been keeping up with Org. related episodes. Even if I saw that, I probably figured they wouldn't do something like that anyway.

[sstimson]

I still remain at the point she knows and she waits. After all she been fooled three times. and part of the saying "three times, shame on me". First she might remember that Yukiko might have a reason for lying to her. Second time, she might remember that during the Haunted Ship case she saw ( And we cannot know for sure what she did or did not see. All we know for sure and she was in the trunk and she came out of hiding when Haibara was in danger. The time between that is unknown) both Sharon and Conan using fake faces and might remember the New York case and Radish turning out to be Sharon. She was after all almost right on in that first case about a dangerous case forcing Shinichi to take a drug to become Conan. She also knows and can prove that she and Conan have the same blood type, even more so if it is rare like might be suggested. Again we can not know how much time she had to examine Conan's phone before she returned it. And what going on behind the scene with Jodie and again Conan Phone. As Jodie was Ran's teacher and friend, there is a good chance they are keeping in touch. I say Ran knows, has all the pieces and keep hinting at Conan that she knows to get him to finally crack and admit to what she already knows. But I think her plan is doomed to fail as Conan, while hearing those hints has a very clever mind and will find ways to explain it away. ( The charm for example, remember about a year ago both Heiji and Shinichi were at a ski slope and as both will cover for the other could claim that Shinichi prints got on it then )

[Partsu]

There is difference of what I want to be, What I believe to be and what is most likely to be.

I want it to be like sstimson said that Ran knows and is waiting.
I believe that she has biased opinion, outwardly she doesn't believe and acts that way but inwardly there is that voice that believes...
and what most likel is the case:
She doesn't want to
believe that Shinichi (and/or Conan)
would lie to her (without good reason and)
so she believes them
when they say that
they are 2 different people.

[kuro_shiro]

I still remain at the point she knows and she waits. After all she been fooled three times. and part of the saying "three times, shame on me".

we know that but she don't know that she has been fooled 3times.

First she might remember that Yukiko might have a reason for lying to her.

how could she remember when she never knew it and hence could not forget??

she might remember that during the Haunted Ship case she saw ( And we cannot know for sure what she did or did not see. All we know for sure and she was in the trunk and she came out of hiding when Haibara was in danger. The time between that is unknown) both Sharon and Conan using fake faces and might remember the New York case and Radish turning out to be Sharon.

well we do know that she has not seen conan take out his mask and sharon was NOT wearing any mask.(akai proved it)
moreover  if she actually rememberd then what??  it is not like ran will beieve that shinichi can wear a mask and become conan.

She was after all almost right on in that first case about a dangerous case forcing Shinichi to take a drug to become Conan.

again ran does not know that she was almost right on the mark.

She also knows and can prove that she and Conan have the same blood type, even more so if it is rare like might be suggested.

if blood type were rare then blood bank would be useless.
Note most rare blood type is not rare enough to single out shinichi like DNA would.

she could also think that conan is shinichi's illigitimate chiild if they have same bloood group.

Again we can not know how much time she had to examine Conan's phone before she returned it.

DOES NOT MATTER
conan has rigged the phone to not carry anything that reveals his identity.
also ,if she has found anything suspicious then she would have just called shinichi while watching conan behind his back to see if conan answers her call or not.

As Jodie was Ran's teacher and friend, there is a good chance they are keeping in touch.

in file 700, ran didn't knew that jodie was still in japan  and has "improved" her japanese.if they had been in touch then it would not be the case besides jodie herself does not know about conan and believe him to be an extraordinary child.

I say Ran knows, has all the pieces and keep hinting at Conan that she knows to get him to finally crack and admit to what she already knows. But I think her plan is doomed to fail as Conan, while hearing those hints has a very clever mind and will find ways to explain it away.

well i say otherwise but until gosho says, we can only say .

  The charm for example, remember about a year ago both Heiji and Shinichi were at a ski slope and as both will cover for the other could claim that Shinichi prints got on it then

one year ago
heiji told the tale to conan NOT knowing that shinichi was the guy.
also they(both pairs) didn't meet and there was no way that conan will say that .


ran knew about the badge of conan and the fact it contain a homin device so the possibility that she knows about conan is shinichi is possible
but i can't find anything like that after file 668 .

Spoiler: why 668??

in file668 ran proposed conan to take bath with her which would not be the case if she thinks conan=shinichi .
hence if ther were any indication of conan=shinichi then they must have come after this file

[believer08]

I think she knows... but she doesn't want to believe it, one half of her refuses the fact. At least, she knows who Conan is "Subconciously".

[S.Vineyard]

Ran basicly "knew" after she confronted Conan after the Magician Murder case in File 134. Yukiko never really fooled her (which was estimated by Yukiko at the end of 140). She only didn't confront him, because she wanted him to tell her herself.  Whichg he actually planned to do in File 254 after he was shot. Only Ai convinced him not to do.

Also, something we often forget:

Ai only gave him the first antidote prototype only to meet Ran as Shinichi for a short moment secretly at the play. His "return" was never the actual plan, they only wanted to fool Ran permamently. Which actually worked, until the Cell phone accident in File 479.

But to come back, to the current happening. The Shirigami/Fake Shinichi Story (File 646-File 654) and the London arc (File 743-File 751) actually didn't push Ran's suspicion, but the Shin/Ran love story, which was a surprise for many, since it was believed Shinichi will confess to Ran his love when the Manga itself ends. Which was wrong.

Nobody expected the "Love is zero" push. And maybe Masumi Sera will be another catalyst for the love story as Minvera Glass was. Personally, I stick to my current theory posted here.:

Currently, since it became a recurrent happening during the last 4 years it is indeed more likely that he will turn into Shinichi again for a short time for some reason, then the effect will wear of and he tries to hide again. But imo. it will somehow end with  a "You don't have to hide anymore" scene with Ran.

[sstimson]

kuro_shiro you are welcome to say what you want PROVIDE you backup your statements like I am going to do.

we know that but she don't know that she has been fooled 3times.

Count them 1) by Yukiko, 2) at the play 3) the phone game. As I believe she know, she know the number is 3

well we do know that she has not seen Conan take out his mask and Sharon was NOT wearing any mask.(Akai proved it)
moreover  if she actually remembered then what??  it is not like ran will believe that Shinichi can wear a mask and become Conan

Think about what you type. She followed Haibara. When she comes out of hiding she see Conan with Haibara arriving. You mean to tell me she can not figure out that Conan was wearing a Haibara mask? Also no, we do not know that. We only know she was hiding and came out of hiding. I of the opinion she watch a good part of the events. As for Sharon mask, she started as Araide and removed it to become Sharon.

again ran does not know that she was almost right on the mark.

If you are right about her not knowing, but she gone down this road three times. I say that as smart as she is, she after time two would know about how Shinichi became Conan. think about it. At the play she knew that Conan was Shinichi because she gave blood.She is smart and I think you forget that.
Next part - I meant the SIM card if she looked at that, and Jodie we know did. They would match.
Next part - Blood type - The hospital ran out of Conan's blood, which is why Ran gave blood. normal they try to stay stocked up, but they are not able do that with the rarer types.

Ran didn't knew that Jodie was still in Japan

Later chapters suggest otherwise. Ran does not seem surprised to see Jodie still in Japan, likely meaning, she keep in contact with her and learned Jodie trip was put off.
next part - Year ago case, It was likely since Conan likes to take credit, he has by now let Heiji know it was him on that case. and can easy prove that.
Again 1) Yukiko, but Ran knows she would lie if her son ask her to, and yet at the same time hint at the relationship.
2) Haibara as Conan and Shinichi. The ship case showed her Conan as Haibara. Again she is smart, and she would figure out if it can go one way, the Conan could be Haibara at the play. 3) as it was only phones, she would know it might just be a phone trick.

[User 4869]

Ran get in Jodie's car to in investigate Jodie. Not Araide/Vermouth/Conan/Haibara.

[sstimson]

Ran get in Jodie's car to in investigate Jodie. Not Araide/Vermouth/Conan/Haibara.

Chapter 432 Page 4 Clearly shows Conan dressed as Haibara is Jodie's car.

Chapter 434 Page 6 You are right, the Trunk moving on that page is jodie's. (open door shows it to be so)

But regardless of who Ran was watching, there is still very good chance she saw a lot of what happened. She would need a air hole so the trunk needed to be open a crack. She would have heard the exchange before that. She saw Sharon change faces in New York and heard about the fact that Yukiko and Sharon both learned the same thing about how to do that. So she must know all is not as it seems. She hears if not sees Conan first called a girl and later hears his voice. He is still wearing Haibara clothes. She is smart and would know that he disguised himself as Haibara She wold also hear about Araide becoming Vermouth. The point remains she would know it is possible for her to get fooled. Also there is the Two Mix case where Conan Dressed as Ayumi. She likely learned what happened with that case.

[kuro_shiro]

kuro_shiro you are welcome to say what you want PROVIDE you backup your statements like I am going to do.

if it were not from those annoying times when we are forced to retype the entire post due to an error.
this reply would have come sooner

we know that but she don't know that she has been fooled 3times.

Count them 1) by Yukiko, 2) at the play 3) the phone game. As I believe she know, she know the number is 3

i mean she could also think that she was the fool and she was enlightened 3 times that conan is a some smart kid NOT shinichi turned small

well we do know that she has not seen Conan take out his mask and Sharon was NOT wearing any mask.(Akai proved it)
moreover  if she actually remembered then what??  it is not like ran will believe that Shinichi can wear a mask and become Conan

Think about what you type. She followed Haibara. When she comes out of hiding she see Conan with Haibara arriving. You mean to tell me she can not figure out that Conan was wearing a Haibara mask? Also no, we do not know that. We only know she was hiding and came out of hiding. I of the opinion she watch a good part of the events. As for Sharon mask, she started as Araide and removed it to become Sharon.

wow you think ran is quite smart let me tell two special facts about her
she is NOT a smart and strong high school girl.
she is strong high school girl who thinks exactly what gosho wants her to think.

from having smart guess to being fooled by shinichi ,it is all gosho's doing
since in file435, ran believed jodie's story it means gosho has made her think that jodie was telling her the only truth.

and how this has anything to do with conan being shinichi??
i am certain that truth behind the scenes is revealed then conan can simply say that he realised that Ai was being targeted by some bad people and he decided to send those people to jail by dressing as her to catch them right handed leaving Ai safe .

again ran does not know that she was almost right on the mark.

If you are right about her not knowing, but she gone down this road three times. I say that as smart as she is, she after time two would know about how Shinichi became Conan. think about it.

only if she is obsessed with the idea only then will she would think about it

At the play she knew that Conan was Shinichi because she gave blood.She is smart and I think you forget that.

well it simply means that conan's blood is same as ran and could be a coincidence since she and shinichi also have smae blood type(from ran's point of view).

Next part - I meant the SIM card if she looked at that, and Jodie we know did. They would match.
Next part - Blood type - The hospital ran out of Conan's blood, which is why Ran gave blood. normal they try to stay stocked up, but they are not able do that with the rarer types.

jodie and ran are not in some consipiracy against conan .
they don't live together and neither remain in contact with each other so much .also jodie does not tell ran about her missions let alone about sherry or conan.
plus jodie took phone but conan kept the sim.

to think that ran told jodie about her suspicions is too much idioctic.
to think jodie tell ran ,that she  fooled conan into thinking  the phone she gave him is his ,is also above limits

also since both ran had shinichi have it , it means the blood type is not so rare since they are not siblings. but 2 people whose parents were school freinds. 

Ran didn't knew that Jodie was still in Japan

Later chapters suggest otherwise. Ran does not seem surprised to see Jodie still in Japan, likely meaning, she keep in contact with her and learned Jodie trip was put off.

which chapter again??

next part - Year ago case, It was likely since Conan likes to take credit, he has by now let Heiji know it was him on that case. and can easy prove that.

conan would not take credit because he realised the truth with the help of his father and believed that other detective=heiji is smarter as he did it by himself.

Yukiko, but Ran knows she would lie if her son ask her to, and yet at the same time hint at the relationship.

exactly how that hints at the rlationship since her story perfectly match with the conan one told by agasa to ran.

Haibara as Conan and Shinichi. The ship case showed her Conan as Haibara. Again she is smart, and she would figure out if it can go one way, the Conan could be Haibara at the play.

again she is not smart it is gosho who make her fool and sometimes smart.

beside if she actually had found that out she would not have believed jodis's story at all

as it was only phones, she would know it might just be a phone trick.

she would never know since gosho would never let her think.

even if she realises then what??
she woud have to sneak up behind conan ,call shinchi and see whether conan replies to a phone or not .
even better she could phone shinichi from PCO and conan from phone to see whether they can answer her at same time or not.

but she didn't realised and that's that.

[Kor]

wow you think ran is quite smart let me tell two special facts about her
she is NOT a smart and strong high school girl.
she is strong high school girl who thinks exactly what gosho wants her to think.

Worst argument ever.

[leokiko]

It's just best to say Ran is dumb, which is true.