Forum reserved for discussing specific points of the story—mostly from the manga. Be warned, these discussions will be current with the manga and will spoil many plot lines for anime-centric fans.
Spimer wrote:Nah, the finger thing is but a coincidence. And the LUM drawing was but a joke, a chance to make a pun.
Others say that the fact there's 3 trays and 2 of them are fake it's a hint saying that, obviously, only one of the 3 RUM suspects is the real one.
well yeah the bra drawing of both LUM and RUMi being naked may be only a joke and coincidence, but in file 918, out of the 3 pictures published in a personal blog, the one where the character was wearing only a bra showing off her manga collection was the one that revealed a secret of "naked truth."
"one should stick with one's original plan" (初志貫徹 shoshi kantetsu)
DCUniverseAficionado wrote:Here are 1,037 text spoilers, courtesy of Fujiwara:
Spoiler:
- Akai and Conan find out that Akai mom shrunk - Sera gets a clue that Okiya = Shuuichi - Sera asks for the drug that can return the flow of time to the way it was, from which Shuuichi and Conan conclude that she knows someone for who the flow of time was reversed. - Also Sera says that her Mom "used to" have large breasts. - Conan deduces that Mary is MI6 - Tsutomu was asked to investigate Haneda's mysterious death by Haneda's dad, a family friend, travelled to the US to do so, and encountered an "unbelievable opponent" in the process - On Tsutomu's command, Sera fam hides their Britishness and moves to Japan - All this was when Mary was pregnant with Masumi, and Tsutomu said he wanted to see his daughter, so he'd solve the case and return
Spoiler:
Well, looks like Tsutomu wasn't present at the scene of the crime, at the time of the crime—he was targeted by the BO after the fact, when he came investigating.
Spoiler:
and someone pointed out that since Tsutomu wasn't present at the crime scene so he can't be that Kuroda who actually has a memory of the crime scene...
"one should stick with one's original plan" (初志貫徹 shoshi kantetsu)
Here's a text summary of the 1,037 spoiler pics that just came out, courtesy of Spimer:
Spoiler:
"Sera is pressing Okiya, arguing that wearing a helmet with those clothes, one would normally assume they're a man, so how did he know her gender? He answers that her butt has the typical hip lines of a girl so it was easy to tell; he says he thought it wasn't worth mentioning it, and she blushes. Conan asks Okiya why he is he hiding his identity from Sera, his sister, and he replies that he wants to keep her out of this as much as he can.
Okiya remembers a time 18 years ago; Masumi wasn't born yet and all members used the "Akai" surname. Mary (36), Shuuichi (15) and Shuukichi (11) hid their British nationality and went to live to Japan. Both sons didn't want to leave their friends but a mail from Tsutomu tells them to speak in Japanese, which they've learn from their parents, from now on. The son of Haneda Yasuharu (a friend of Tsutomu), Haneda Kouji (who's met the Akais) has died in a mysterious way in the US; the father asked Tsutomu to look into it. Tsutomu heads to the US but there figures out that nasty folk are involved so, to protect his wife and kids he tells them to hide in Japan. Mary says that Tsutomu wanted to meet his yet-to-be-born daugther and that Tsutomu will defeat "the bad guys" and come back. Okiya reflects on how much (Sera) has grown since then.
Meanwhile, Takagi, who's received a call, reports to Megure that all famed appraisers within Tokoya are either on a trip to other prefectures or overseas or are ill so nobody can come before the next day.
Toujima says that he'd scheduled to meet with a buyer of the tray today's evening; the buyer comes from overseas so he can't let the chance slip by. Chouno also says he has the 40th anniversary party of his business this evening and wanted to talk about the tray on his speech. Sakamaki has an appointment with a famed cameraman who she called for in 3 hours to take photos for the pamphlet of her art musueum so she can't wait until tomorrow.
Takagi tries to argue that they need to keep the trays as evidence but steps into something. That "something" is the hearing aid the Professor made, the "Earwing Aid"; all the clients know that the victim was hard of hearing but didn't expect him to be using a hearing aid. Agasa, hearing how the victim could talk normally with the clients, rejoices at how good his invention is; Chiba says that the victim sent Agasa an email 20 minutes before the crime; Agasa answered that he was about to head there; even though the victim's phone is set to make a sound when a mail comes in, there's no traces of the vic having read it; Haibara notices that the hearing aid must've been malfunctioning already so she tells Agasa that his invention's naming is really odd.
Sera then says that Haibara feels odder instead; she asks her to give her the same drug that shrunk her and Conan; she says "that drug to restore the flow of time to normal"; Okiya then points that someone's flow of time must've been reserved; Sera gets annoyed at him and tries to kick him but he easily dodges. Okiya replies that she's also to blame for wanting to kick him just because he said something that irritated her so they're "50:50"; Sera feels that his words are familiar. Okiya tells her to avoid such rought actions if she wants to be a like a girl; Sera replies that her mother was huge-breasted so Sera herself will also eventually become "girl-like" too; Okiya points at her "was" and asks if her mother has died; she denies that. Conan realizes that Okiya is trying to asses if his mother is safe or not; he thinks that Mary is indeed the mother of the two them and the person he met in the sea in the past was indeed Mary; Sera is asking about the APTX4869 because she must've been fed the drug and shrunk as well. If that's the case, he wonders why she was fed it. Given her deductive abilities, fighting abilities and her British nationality he thinks that the "sister outside of the domain" actually means "MI6".
Meanwhile, the suspects are trying to leave the house but are stopped by Megure. They argue that the investigation can't continue without an appraiser and that the 2 housekeepers might be involved; the victim was going to show something to the clients and explain to them about it; that something was the Professor's dish from the small box; Okiya and Conan borrow it and see that a spot of the backside has paint peeled off it and has a crack; Agasa says that when he found it there was no such damage on it; Conan, Okiya and Sera notice something and Conan asks Agasa about what direction the crane was pointing when he flipped the tray; Takagi flips the 3 trays again and they ask him if any of the cushions within the boxes had blood on it; Takagi replies that 1 of them did and so all of them notice the truth about this case."
Spimer wrote:
blackmoon wrote:
Spoiler:
and someone pointed out that since Tsutomu wasn't present at the crime scene so he can't be that Kuroda who actually has a memory of the crime scene...
Spoiler:
But that could be from looking at the crime scenes photos, too. So we can't discard that yet (although, personally, I never liked the idea).
Spoiler:
Perhaps, but... I just can't imagine Tsutomu, after all this time, having an incorrect interpretation or impression of that crime scene—or even missing info. Him being Hyōe would seem to imply just that—and then there'd be the matter of why and how he took Hyōe's place, in terms of his long investigation of that crime. Certainly, taking the place of the man who seems to be the boss of the secret police agency Zero would put a lot of power and influence in his hands... but how would it help him with the Kōji Haneda/Amanda Hughes case? Is it just to use Zero/the Japanese Public Security Bureaus to finally arrest the culprit?
If you asked me to chose between which male Rum suspect I think is actually Tsutomu in disguise... then, right now... I'd have to pick Kanenori. The possibility of him being Hyōe is not one for me to dismiss completely, yet... but it seems to me he'd still be in the thick of the action, rather than acting from a command-and-control position—Hyōe has only been "on the ground," so to speak, once (Burning Tent case), while Kanenori has consistently been "on the ground" (His intro case, Boss reveal case, Snowy mountain case with Rei, Kogorō and Conan). Hyōe directly approached Rumi, while Kanenori as only watched her from afar—while I do think that now Rumi has the highest chances of being Rum (that she's ever had, in my book), I still think her feelings towards Kōji are not ones his killer would have... and I still don't think Rum would actually carry the Shogi Bishop Piece that Kōji used for his dying message around for 17 years. I still think Rum would've simply destroyed such evidence.
But then there's Gosho's SDB Black+ comment that implies there are only three Rum suspects. The only way Hyōe can be Rum is if he's letting Bourbon, Kir, Shūichi, Ai and Conan all live... only so he can get them all in one fell swoop, using their own plan (the one Rei, Shūichi and the Kudos discussed "offscreen" between 1,012 and 1,013) against them. Otherwise, Rum is either right on top of Shinichi/Conan and Shiho/Ai (Rumi), or is right on top of Kogorō and Rei/Tōru/Bourbon (Kanenori).
In other words... my wait for decisive info in this arc continues.
“Life is infinitely stranger than anything which the mind of man could invent. We would not dare to conceive the things which are really mere commonplaces of existence. If we could fly out of that window hand in hand, hover over this great city, gently remove the roofs, and and peep in at the queer things which are going on, the strange coincidences, the plannings, the cross-purposes, the wonderful chains of events, working through generations, and leading to the most outre results, it would make all fiction with its conventionalities and foreseen conclusions most stale and unprofitable.” “Education never ends... it is a series of lessons, with the greatest for the last.” ― Arthur Conan Doyle, The Complete Adventures of Sherlock Holmes and His Last Bow "I have decided to stick to love... hate is too great a burden to bear." — Martin Luther King Jr. (A Testament of Hope: The Essential Writings and Speeches of Martin Luther King, Jr)
This new info was something much needed. But there is a very important element about Kohji case too. Mary remembered the flashback just like Rumi had remembered it. Mary was not there during the commotion, so possibly Mary had concluded it from the photo of the crime scene which was supplied to Tsutomu by Haneda's dad. Now Kuroda's memory has a different angle, if you compare it with Mary and Rumi's pictures, it says something completely different.
It misses the blood and the picture is taken from a shorter height. The angle is different. That angle extensively covered Haneda's right cheek/floor facing cheek, which should have been drenched in blood, but no such indication is given in Hoye's memory. So the idea which I was peddling before that Rumi cleaned it up goes by the window now. The only possible issue is Kuroda's hazy memory(which would imply he is not lying at all and no switch had happened.) but that is up for the debate. Given he can remember the front page of the newspaper article about Kohji case, I don't think he would be missing the blood(the characteristic thing of the murder) from a photo.
Now Rumi's fake name can draw out two types of people, a) Those who want to suppress the truth about Kohji case. b) Those who are investigating Kohji case. There were only two who got the meaning(at least shown to us) One wants to investigate Rumi. The other thinks Rumi is quite quick witted.
This new info was something much needed. But there is a very important element about Kohji case too. Mary remembered the flashback just like Rumi had remembered it. Mary was not there during the commotion, so possibly Mary had concluded it from the photo of the crime scene which was supplied to Tsutomu by Haneda's dad. Now Kuroda's memory has a different angle, if you compare it with Mary and Rumi's pictures, it says something completely different.
It misses the blood and the picture is taken from a shorter height. The angle is different. That angle extensively covered Haneda's right cheek/floor facing cheek, which should have been drenched in blood, but no such indication is given in Hoye's memory. So the idea which I was peddling before that Rumi cleaned it up goes by the window now. The only possible issue is Kuroda's hazy memory(which would imply he is not lying at all and no switch had happened.) but that is up for the debate. Given he can remember the front page of the newspaper article about Kohji case, I don't think he would be missing the blood(the characteristic thing of the murder) from a photo.
Now Rumi's fake name can draw out two types of people, a) Those who want to suppress the truth about Kohji case. b) Those who are investigating Kohji case. There were only two who got the meaning(at least shown to us) One wants to investigate Rumi. The other thinks Rumi is quite quick witted.
Spoiler:
Yeah, I thought it looked like blood was still running out of has mouth, there—her recollection aligned more with Rumi's than Hyōe's.
If the image of Kōji with blood running down his mouth is the official crime scene photo, then it's really strange that Hyōe would recall there being no blood—especially considering Rumi recalls there being blood.
This recollection of Hyōe coming after the official photo was taken would mean that the blood was wiped off at some point after the photo was taken... but that'd be pointless, right? It wouldn't do the culprit any good—if they somehow managed to slip in and do so—and I can't think of a reason the police would wipe the blood off.
So, if the blood wasn't wiped off after the photo was taken... wouldn't that mean Hyōe saw Kōji like that before Rumi did and before the photo was taken?... and wouldn't that mean there'd be a chance Kōji wasn't yet dead when Hyōe saw him laying on the ground like that? After all, since no blood was coming from his mouth, there's a chance he wasn't yet dead, at that point, right?
And has made no moves towards her after that. Unless he does make a move—until we see interaction between him and her—it would seem that Kanenori's prime concern is not keeping an eye on Rumi.
“Life is infinitely stranger than anything which the mind of man could invent. We would not dare to conceive the things which are really mere commonplaces of existence. If we could fly out of that window hand in hand, hover over this great city, gently remove the roofs, and and peep in at the queer things which are going on, the strange coincidences, the plannings, the cross-purposes, the wonderful chains of events, working through generations, and leading to the most outre results, it would make all fiction with its conventionalities and foreseen conclusions most stale and unprofitable.” “Education never ends... it is a series of lessons, with the greatest for the last.” ― Arthur Conan Doyle, The Complete Adventures of Sherlock Holmes and His Last Bow "I have decided to stick to love... hate is too great a burden to bear." — Martin Luther King Jr. (A Testament of Hope: The Essential Writings and Speeches of Martin Luther King, Jr)
That is where I get stuck. If Hoye remembers a dying Kohji(minus blood) then it will mean Hoye had seen Kohji dying from a lower angle did nothing to alleviate his pain and now is chasing around Rumi who has "U MASCARA" in her name. That would mean Hoye as at least an apathetic scoundrel at best and a rowdy killer at worst. That sort of still a Too deep of a leap.
1,038 text spoilers in Chinese are out, courtesy of 2leaves and Fujiwara:
Spoiler:
- Cover page has Sera confronting Conan & Ai - Sera knows Subaru = Akai... the expression at the end portrays this very well, but it's not actually spelled out - Sera returns home, and Mary mentions her husband... - The information is all on the last 5 pages... combined with the last time Mary took Conan's bow-tie voice changer to solve the case, Conan seems to have figured her out.
Will update if translations are changed, or if more come out before the spoiler pics arrive.
EDIT: 1,038 spoiler pics now out.
We can expect 1,039 spoilers around August 1st-3rd—in other words, we're in for a month-long break after this.
EDIT (#2): Here are Pages 12-16 of 1,038, translated:
Spoiler:
Page 12 Okiya: "Show, don't hide"... Okiya: A proverb that means "the more you try to hide something, the more likely it will be discovered by others". Judging by the fact that "Kurisuke" is written at the end... Okiya: The professor's uncle Kurisuke probably fixed that plate, which he'd accidentally broken, with glue... Okiya: But being afraid of someone finding out... Okiya: He painted the whole plate with a similar-looking oil color. Okiya: However, he was found out and got a good scolding... Okiya: And thus I wager that your uncle Kurisuke put the plate into this box with that proverb written on it... Okiya: To turn it into a reminder... Okiya: The reason the paint came off... Was likely that Nishitsu-san dropped some oil pain solvent on it... Agasa: I see, so that's what happened... Sera: But still... Sera: "Show, don't hide"...? Sera: What a strangely fitting proverb... Sera: Don't you two think so? Conan: Hahaha...
Page 13 Sera: Well, today was quite interesting! Sera: Laters! Ai: Is she planning on coming again? Ai: Give me a break, man... Agasa: How troublesome... Okiya: Well, she's unlikely to drop by all that often... Okiya: And we kept her in check just fine... Okiya (flashback): What do you mean to say by "restores the stream of time"? Okiya (flashback): Restoring it means it's currently being disturbed... Okiya (flashback): Could it be that the one whose stream is disturbed is not you, but someone else...?
Page 14 Sera (flashback): It's none of your business! Okiya: It seem like she, too, has no desire to be investigated... Conan: Ah, about that... Okiya: It's all right... Okiya: I grasped the gist of it... Okiya (inner monologue): Even though I won't believe it... Okiya (inner monologue): Until I see it with my own eyes... Conan (inner monologue): No, that's not it... Conan (inner monologue): It's true that I wanted to tell him... Conan (inner monologue): That his and Sera's mother, Mary-san... Conan (inner monologue): Took APTX 4869 and is currently shrunk to a middle school-aged girl, but... Conan (inner monologue): What I really wanted to confirm...
Page 15 Conan (inner monologue): Was Mary-san's identity... Conan (inner monologue): A British person with such intelligence and fighting skills... Conan (inner monologue): Who called themselves "little sister from outside the domain"... Conan (inner monologue): Another word for "domain" is "territory", which can be abbreviated "ter" and if we take out the "ter" from "sister", we get "SIS"... Conan (inner monologue): In other words "Secret Intelligence Service"... Conan (inner monologue): The British foreign intelligence service also known as MI6! Conan (inner monologue): Does the fact that she hinted at that by letting me know the name "sister from outside the domain"... Conan (inner monologue): Mean that she was testing me? Conan (inner monologue): To see whether I am capable and trustworthy enough to become her collaborator...? Mary: 50:50...?
Page 16 Mary: My pet phrase? Sera: Yeah! You say that from time to time, right? Mary: Ah, your Dad liked to say that... Mary: I guess our deceased oldest son inherited it from him... Sera: Shuu-nii did? Mary: More importantly, what about that drug? Mary: Do you think you can get your hands on it? Sera: Right now it's still impossible. I encountered a strange obstacle... Mary: A strange obstacle? Sera: That graduate student who lives next to the professor... Mary: Is he such a noteworthy person? Sera: A-ah... Sera: Well... Okiya (flashback): It's 50:50... Okiya (flashback): You're also at fault... Sera (inner monologue): There's no way, right? End page side note: What will Conan do in light of the Akai family secrets that are gradually becoming clear--?
“Life is infinitely stranger than anything which the mind of man could invent. We would not dare to conceive the things which are really mere commonplaces of existence. If we could fly out of that window hand in hand, hover over this great city, gently remove the roofs, and and peep in at the queer things which are going on, the strange coincidences, the plannings, the cross-purposes, the wonderful chains of events, working through generations, and leading to the most outre results, it would make all fiction with its conventionalities and foreseen conclusions most stale and unprofitable.” “Education never ends... it is a series of lessons, with the greatest for the last.” ― Arthur Conan Doyle, The Complete Adventures of Sherlock Holmes and His Last Bow "I have decided to stick to love... hate is too great a burden to bear." — Martin Luther King Jr. (A Testament of Hope: The Essential Writings and Speeches of Martin Luther King, Jr)
I used to assume that Tsutomo was directly involved in the Kouji case, so it's pretty interesting to find out that he wasn't a direct player himself, but only called in later to investigate.
So the "50:50"-thing is one of Tsutomo's phrases, this indicates yet again that his way of talking really rubs off on other people...the theory that he somehow knows Gin seems even more likely now.
And if his wife is from the MI6, I wonder if he is too?
I used to assume that Tsutomo was directly involved in the Kouji case, so it's pretty interesting to find out that he wasn't a direct player himself, but only called in later to investigate.
So the "50:50"-thing is one of Tsutomo's phrases, this indicates yet again that his way of talking really rubs off on other people...the theory that he somehow knows Gin seems even more likely now.
And if his wife is from the MI6, I wonder if he is too?
Well, hard to imagine RUM the weak horse was able to even deceive Mary who was a real MI6? A formidable enemy that is actually capable of being No.2 of BO.
And...speaking of 50:50... it reminded me of a song from a previous Conan movie titled 'always' [a single by Mai Kuraki that was used as the 12th closing for Detective Conan the anime, as well as the official song used for the fifth movie in the franchise, Countdown to Heaven.]
"Sometimes you win Sometimes you lose It doesn't matter You make mistakes but for a reason There's a chance to be won God bless you for being yourself Sometimes life is so beautiful yeah"
Gosho has admitted that there's some mistakes in the chronology that was published alongside the Ripples Flashback, and Subaru's comment of "18 years" needs to be fixed which means that, as we thought, it's supposed to be 17 years ago instead of 18.
Also, he confirmed that Akai's "current time" age is 32 years, finally giving him an exact age. He did say he might be 31-32 back in Let's Talk Day but this cements it.
So he's still a young ass, though he looks far older than he really is.
My dad’s a soldier blue I’ll be a soldier, too When I grow older you will see me rescue you I’ll teach you this old song so you can sing along When I am dead and gone the day won’t be so long.
Damn, it's been so long since I last checked the Manga out, seems like some interesting developments have happened over the last 10+ chapters, though at this rate I feel like I might as well just wait for the Anime to cover this content, with maybe occasionally checking what new info was revealed.
I kind of want to read the last 4 cases but catching up would kill me so bad. I've just been re-reading the Bourbon arc instead. I've yet to watch the Scarlet School Trip animated so might start to go through the cases from file 1000 onwards again at some point...
Kind of skimmed through the last 4 chapters, mainly the plot stuff and not the case itself. Spoiler tagging just in case
Spoiler:
So yeah, looks like Sera will find out Akai is Subaru pretty soon, looking forward to that. And of course the reveal that Mari is MI6, we called it like 5 years ago and now it's finally revealed, good to know. Is the general consensus that Rumi = Asaka, Wakita = RUM and Kuroda is Akai daddy?
