Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 994-996

Forum reserved for discussing specific points of the story—mostly from the manga. Be warned, these discussions will be current with the manga and will spoil many plot lines for anime-centric fans.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 994-99X

Postby DCUniverseAficionado » June 2nd, 2017, 12:35 am

Spoiler pics for 995 are out (5 in total):
https://tieba.baidu.com/p/5143379367
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 994-99X

Postby Spimer » June 2nd, 2017, 1:48 am

Summary of spoilers:

No break next week, next file resolution
Spoiler:
File 995: You don't know?

The police arrive and examine the scene: the flower vase is the murder weapon yet it's very heavy (as heavy as 30 kilogram rice bag, Takagi says) and the manager argues no-one of the staff is strong enough to swing that around, Megure admits he couldn't if it was filled with water.

The victim was a smoker and used to come to this room to smoke.

Kogoro suspects the manager's brother but he argues that he suffered a dislocation when playing grass baseball and he can't even swing the frypans on his restaurant: Kogoro glances at hte manager but focuses on the brother again arguing he could be pretending: the brother then says they call the hospital since they should have an X-ray plate.

Sera figures out the trick but knows that any of the 3 suspects could've pulled it off: Sonoko points at something being out of place (probably Conan's lack of comments).

Sera asks Conan and he says he got a general idea of the trick at the point he entered the room: Sera argues that Conan said "I don't know" he referred to Ran and the other girls' trip and wants to know what she meant by "something you experience when you grow up, it's not a normal trip". Sera is baffled that he cares more about that than the case.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 994-99X

Postby k11chi » June 2nd, 2017, 12:33 pm

That epic file 1000 build up. :-X :-X :-X
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 994-99X

Postby saorin » June 5th, 2017, 5:07 am

Spoiler:
At first, I was thinking the trip is for Ran's birthday, but then I don't see the point of telling Conan he'd experience that himself "later".
Guess a wedding might make more sense thematically, like Chekhov said. Probably also a good setup for the 1000 Ran Shinichi thingie.
Do the Japanese go on (tame) "hen nights" like the Europeans do? Probably not, Right? ;D :D

On second thought, they are looking at sightseeing spots and since Sera and Sonoko are with it, what about a class trip? Isn't it a common theme in manga/anime and displayed as super important for high schoolers? It would also explain why they think Shinichi might turn up. Maybe this then coincides with Ran's birthday.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 994-99X

Postby Swagnarok » June 5th, 2017, 1:04 pm

saorin wrote:
Spoiler:
At first, I was thinking the trip is for Ran's birthday, but then I don't see the point of telling Conan he'd experience that himself "later".
Guess a wedding might make more sense thematically, like Chekhov said. Probably also a good setup for the 1000 Ran Shinichi thingie.
Do the Japanese go on (tame) "hen nights" like the Europeans do? Probably not, Right? ;D :D

On second thought, they are looking at sightseeing spots and since Sera and Sonoko are with it, what about a class trip? Isn't it a common theme in manga/anime and displayed as super important for high schoolers? It would also explain why they think Shinichi might turn up. Maybe this then coincides with Ran's birthday.


Spoiler:
In the anime, Ran's 17. Hence, her eighteenth birthday would mark her transition to adulthood. However, there are two problems with this: First, that in the manga, which is the only source that really matters, Ran's only 16. Her seventeenth birthday wouldn't be all that significant a milestone. Second, Conan would surely know if her birthday was approaching, yet he doesn't seem to have a clue about what's going on.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 994-99X

Postby Serinox » June 5th, 2017, 1:41 pm

Swagnarok wrote:In the anime, Ran's 17. Hence, her eighteenth birthday would mark her transition to adulthood.

Since you are still a minor at age 18 in Japan: no, it wouldn't.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 994-99X

Postby RucyL » June 7th, 2017, 2:33 pm

Love how everyone is discussing the trip and not the case.

So, it is almost obvious that the culprit will most likely be
Spoiler:
the girl with the ponytail, as she shouted when Takagi was going to look under the furniture. Conan looked under it at the start of the file, figuring out the trick. IDK what is down there but it should serve well enough as proof. Maybe something that would make the jar lighter???


And, about the trip, Idk, school trips sounds very plausible.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 994-99X

Postby jimmy_kud0_tv2 » June 7th, 2017, 11:02 pm

Spoiler:
Looks like the back of the victim's sleeve has some dirt on it (second file, page 2). Seems like maybe the victim was reaching under the the counter thing the same way that Takagi was to get the thing that is still under there. It looks to me like it could be a earring, but for some reason I kept thinking it could be a cuff link thing. None of the suspects or victim seem to have anything like that though in the first file, however there does seem to be another round similar object in the toolbox. If the killer told the victim to get something from under the counter, they wouldn't have to lift the vase very far and just tip it over or drop it on his head. However, his collar seems to be wet which smeared the blood, as if he was already on the floor as the water spilled out from the vase. Like he was already dead before the vase was tipped over. Then the body propped up after the fact and hit with something else so that the blood could drip down vertically and imply that he was sitting in that position when killed.

ALSO, maybe an art error, but at the end of 944 the counter that the victim is leaning up against has regular legs, but in 945 it has wheels for legs. I guess the change was made so that we could imagine that the counter would be easier to move?
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 994-99X

Postby Swagnarok » June 7th, 2017, 11:59 pm

Spoiler:
What I initially figured was that it's some kind of gravity-based booby trap where the heavy vase simply falls onto him, maybe from the top of a shelf/locker. But the problem with this is that the vase would've surely been shattered upon hitting the floor. Heck, merely picking it up and slamming it into the guy's head probably should've kinda broke it.
The way I saw it, that thing underneath the cabinet looked like a barbell, though I'll acknowledge that's not the way barbells usually look in 2017. They're not typically that spherical on the ends (and also, how the heck could a big barbell have fit under there?). The problem with the victim being assaulted as he was bending over is that you still have to lift the super heavy vase (assuming it was full of water) and slam it into his head. Furthermore, the water would've sloshed and spilled on the cabinet itself, or anywhere else really, but instead the water's in an ridiculously neat spill in one spot.
I'm guessing maybe the water was initially in ice form and NOT originally contained within the vase but then it was allowed to melt into a neat puddle over time near and inside the vase, and perhaps the cigarettes served to heat up the room and speed up the process.
I don't see how the broken padlock fits into this. Was this done to make it look like a burglary gone wrong? Padlocks like that generally require a key instead of inserting a numerical combination so it seems like if it was a matter of getting the laptop (presumably to login to the blog and assume control over its content) the culprit could've just taken the key from him. The item used to smash the padlock shouldn't be relevant as the culprit could've just went out the door with the restaurant key and disposed of it, but due to this case's particular narrative it probably will be.
It would seem that Gosho's trying to make Isuzu Naomura look suspicious, especially due to the whole "Oh wait I just remembered something please don't look under there" moment, but in truth she seems to have the least motive of the three. She could've gotten her family's debt paid off by dating him, and in doing so she could avoided having him defame her family's business on the blog, as he had yet to do so. In short, there's no apparent reason for her to kill him.
I actually got to read the two files in English before 996 came out, and I got to re-read them over and over again, but I got nothing.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 994-99X

Postby MeiTanteixX » June 8th, 2017, 11:27 am

How the Culprit opened the padlock using nut wrenches
(credits to @Ned[discord] for finding it)
https://youtu.be/1jJP0CcuJyE?t=39
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 994-99X

Postby Swagnarok » June 8th, 2017, 12:24 pm

Spoiler:
Assuming that Gosho didn't just cheat and make some random other object the murder weapon, here's one thing the culprit could've done:
A reasonably thick layer of ice could be applied to the vase opening, to seal it and keep the water inside from getting out. It would be filled almost to the top with liquid water, up until where the ice starts.
The case was stolen overnight, and ice doesn't last long at room temperature. However, the entire inside of the vase couldn't have been frozen or else it would expand and crack the vase. Hence, the entire vase was not stored in the kitchen freezer (show me a restaurant kitchen without a freezer and I'll show you a bearded woman). UNLESS...the culprit first fills the vase mostly with saltwater, which only freezes at very low temperatures, and then a little bit of freshwater at the top, which won't sink to the bottom because, as one would imagine, freshwater is lighter than salt water, which means it floats to the surface. With this trick, one could create a seal of ice to keep water in even if you turn it upside down.
I find it suspicious that the manager's brother said he went to talk to the cooks "because my sister asked me to" when it was his idea. He could've hid the vase in the freezer overnight using the aforementioned trick and then used the kitchen visit as an excuse to retrieve it for the murder. He never said anything to dismiss the possibility that he could've made himself a copy of the restaurant keys in advance and instead just kept pointing to his dislocated wrist. I don't find his wrist to be a very compelling argument; if I'm not mistaken, one can undergo surgery (and in some cases surgery is too harsh a term) to get that fixed. Had he visited a different hospital for this than the one where he got X-Rayed at, he could fool the police into falsely believing his wrist to be presently dislocated.
Keep in mind the ice seal trick has serious issues in practice. First, there's the question of him carrying/dragging the heavy vase out of the kitchen without anybody noticing. Second, there's the question of him carrying the vase to the adjacent changing room. Per the findings of the police investigation, one cannot go from the kitchen to the changing room without being easily visible to someone in the kitchen looking out.
There's a good chance that at one point Toshinori Motosu, the manager's brother was cheating on his girlfriend/fiancee with Naomura Isuzu, in a brief but passionate fling that Motosu eventually broke off. Saraie (the victim) likely obtained photographic evidence of this, which was what he meant when he threatened to "crush" Motosu. Saraie likely stored the photos on his laptop, which he could've uploaded to the internet at any time, explaining why Motosu might be desperate to get his hands on that. Isuzu likely still harbors feelings for Motosu, which is why she turned down Saraie's offer, and she figured out that her former lover is the likely culprit, and she figured out somehow that important evidence or something could be found under the counter, which is probably why she tried to divert attention away from under there when Takagi was about to take a look.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 994-99X

Postby Zerozaki4869 » June 8th, 2017, 2:52 pm

Spoiler:
I think the culprit and the person who broke the lock was two different persons. The nut wrenches were used to break-open the padlock, as it's shown by MTX. The padlock also sustained similar damage, so that was the trick. If culprit wanted to open that padlock, she would have just taken they keys off the victim. No need for such a hassle. The body of the victim appears to be quite untouched, so probably there was no body search going on after killing him. The toolbox was there in the cupboard but the body was already leaning over it when it was found, given the culprit didn't open the padlock it was a third party's action even before the crime was committed.
Now we know that the victim had some info on the manager's brother which would have crushed him. So he has the strongest motive to steal the tablet from the victim to get rid of the incriminating stuff which can ruin his business.

Now for the trick behind the murder, I think that Newton's first law, i.e. moment of inertia was used to deal with the victim. The vase was kept on the edge of the cupboard, there was a mechanism installed beneath the cupboard which if activated would slide the cupboard away from the wall.
Now given the victim's habit of sitting on it while smoking proves that the victim was sure that cupboard was seemingly rigid(won't move from weight) so he didn't took precaution and was set up by the culprit to reach for something using his right hand(the smudges on his right hand, his odd body position seems to support this hypothesis) and thus activated the mechanism, which toppled the vase on his head. As he was reaching for the thing quite deeply so his face was vertical and faced his left cheek away from the wall, so the injury caused on his left fore head and he died on the spot. To make it look like that someone attacked him with vase(filled with water and flowers) the culprit poured a little water on his shirt collar.

For the culprit, we can easily exclude the man. The waitress was hiding from the loan sharks but the man discovered it only on that eventful day. From the expression of the waitress we do find that it was the first time she heard this stuff. So previously she was only approached by the victim to be his GF nothing more was there.
Now apparently the manager lacks the motive but given the fact that manager's brother has already complained against him and the victim was the ex-live in partner of the manager. The victim was known for his revengeful nature and if this word of complaining even came to his ears the manager's life would be destroyed, the victim would have waited till the manager got married and then after taking over as the new manager would have showed some inconvenient pics./stuff of the ex-manager. So this was the motive of the manager. And I rule her as the killer, but the waitress can be also the killer using the same trick but I think that is far less likely.
Last edited by Zerozaki4869 on June 9th, 2017, 12:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 994-99X

Postby DCUniverseAficionado » June 8th, 2017, 11:10 pm

Spoiler pics for 996 are out (5 in total):
https://tieba.baidu.com/p/5153698030

Unfortunately, a 3 week break will follow—it won't be until July 7th until we get 997 spoiler pics.
“Life is infinitely stranger than anything which the mind of man could invent. We would not dare to conceive the things which are really mere commonplaces of existence. If we could fly out of that window hand in hand, hover over this great city, gently remove the roofs, and and peep in at the queer things which are going on, the strange coincidences, the plannings, the cross-purposes, the wonderful chains of events, working through generations, and leading to the most outre results, it would make all fiction with its conventionalities and foreseen conclusions most stale and unprofitable.”
“Education never ends... it is a series of lessons, with the greatest for the last.”
― Arthur Conan Doyle, The Complete Adventures of Sherlock Holmes and His Last Bow
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 994-996

Postby k11chi » June 9th, 2017, 6:47 am

Spoiler:
This school trip case will be the build up case for 1000 then huh.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 994-99X

Postby alphajjc » June 9th, 2017, 9:51 am

DCUniverseAficionado wrote:Spoiler pics for 996 are out (5 in total):
https://tieba.baidu.com/p/5153698030

Unfortunately, a 3 week break will follow—it won't be until July 7th until we get 997 spoiler pics.


No shock there. Typical Gosho

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