Fit the pieces together

Forum reserved for discussing specific points of the story—mostly from the manga. Be warned, these discussions will be current with the manga and will spoil many plot lines for anime-centric fans.
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Re: Fit the pieces together

Postby Spimer » January 17th, 2017, 6:33 pm

Well, in the flashback case he said he was studying in the US to get the green card and eventually join the FBI or a similar org to figure out what happened to Tsutomu.

Before that he told Conan in the first ASACA case that his father was the reason he joined the FBI.

Maybe he got influenced by movie clichés or maybe the FBI was looking for a profile like his at the time.
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Re: Fit the pieces together

Postby MeiTanteixX » January 17th, 2017, 6:42 pm

Spimer wrote:Well, in the flashback case he said he was studying in the US to get the green card and eventually join the FBI or a similar org to figure out what happened to Tsutomu.

Before that he told Conan in the first ASACA case that his father was the reason he joined the FBI.

Maybe he got influenced by movie clichés or maybe the FBI was looking for a profile like his at the time.

or, once again, James was nice enough to offer his closest friend's son an opportunity to legally work on his father's case by having him join the FBI.
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Re: Fit the pieces together

Postby Serinox » January 17th, 2017, 7:15 pm

MeiTanteixX wrote:
Spimer wrote:Well, in the flashback case he said he was studying in the US to get the green card and eventually join the FBI or a similar org to figure out what happened to Tsutomu.

Before that he told Conan in the first ASACA case that his father was the reason he joined the FBI.

Maybe he got influenced by movie clichés or maybe the FBI was looking for a profile like his at the time.

or, once again, James was nice enough to offer his closest friend's son an opportunity to legally work on his father's case by having him join the FBI.

Assuming that James knew the Akai family through Tsutomu and not just through Shuichi.
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Re: Fit the pieces together

Postby Tantei San » January 18th, 2017, 10:21 am

Serinox wrote:
MeiTanteixX wrote:
Spimer wrote:Well, in the flashback case he said he was studying in the US to get the green card and eventually join the FBI or a similar org to figure out what happened to Tsutomu.

Before that he told Conan in the first ASACA case that his father was the reason he joined the FBI.

Maybe he got influenced by movie clichés or maybe the FBI was looking for a profile like his at the time.

or, once again, James was nice enough to offer his closest friend's son an opportunity to legally work on his father's case by having him join the FBI.

Assuming that James knew the Akai family through Tsutomu and not just through Shuichi.

But don't you think It would have been easier for him to join MI6, mother's in that organization and he is also british. He later became american.
There is a purpose of him joining FBI and also he went way too much to get a green card and meeting James Black. I would say he hasn't told the full truth, even to mary.
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Re: Fit the pieces together

Postby PhantomWriter » January 18th, 2017, 10:50 pm

Tantei San wrote:
Serinox wrote:
MeiTanteixX wrote:
Spimer wrote:Well, in the flashback case he said he was studying in the US to get the green card and eventually join the FBI or a similar org to figure out what happened to Tsutomu.

Before that he told Conan in the first ASACA case that his father was the reason he joined the FBI.

Maybe he got influenced by movie clichés or maybe the FBI was looking for a profile like his at the time.

or, once again, James was nice enough to offer his closest friend's son an opportunity to legally work on his father's case by having him join the FBI.

Assuming that James knew the Akai family through Tsutomu and not just through Shuichi.

But don't you think It would have been easier for him to join MI6, mother's in that organization and he is also british. He later became american.
There is a purpose of him joining FBI and also he went way too much to get a green card and meeting James Black. I would say he hasn't told the full truth, even to mary.


Not only that, regarding his citizenship, but the FBI has stricter standards. All special agents of the FBI require a four-year college degree, preferably in relation to a needed specialty, and three years of full-time work experience, along with being over 21 at the time of application. MI5 doesn't require a college degree for their agents and their minimum age is 18. It doesn't say on SIS/MI6's site about specifics of degrees. The FBI is also stricter about drug use history, having a minimum clean time that's longer than MI6's (3 years versus 12 months).

While MI6 and MI5 both requires a person to have been in the UK for the past 9 out of the last 10 years, there are exceptions for that, including studying abroad or if you are representing the UK government. Shuichi would have been able to apply for MI6 and it would certainly have been easier.

Though, speaking of media, both MI6 and the FBI have a pretty good image. It's not like the CIA's image being extremely hit or miss. ;)

My guess is that he needed access to Kohji's case and that case, taking place in America with American citizens involved, would be under the FBI's jurisdiction. The CIA usually deals with outside of the US, MI5 is internal affairs for the UK, and MI6 wouldn't have access to the case because it doesn't appear to them to be connected to the UK.
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Re: Fit the pieces together

Postby Nemomon » January 19th, 2017, 12:50 am

Spoiler:
PhantomWriter wrote:
Tantei San wrote:
Serinox wrote:
MeiTanteixX wrote:
Spimer wrote:Well, in the flashback case he said he was studying in the US to get the green card and eventually join the FBI or a similar org to figure out what happened to Tsutomu.

Before that he told Conan in the first ASACA case that his father was the reason he joined the FBI.

Maybe he got influenced by movie clichés or maybe the FBI was looking for a profile like his at the time.

or, once again, James was nice enough to offer his closest friend's son an opportunity to legally work on his father's case by having him join the FBI.

Assuming that James knew the Akai family through Tsutomu and not just through Shuichi.

But don't you think It would have been easier for him to join MI6, mother's in that organization and he is also british. He later became american.
There is a purpose of him joining FBI and also he went way too much to get a green card and meeting James Black. I would say he hasn't told the full truth, even to mary.


Not only that, regarding his citizenship, but the FBI has stricter standards. All special agents of the FBI require a four-year college degree, preferably in relation to a needed specialty, and three years of full-time work experience, along with being over 21 at the time of application. MI5 doesn't require a college degree for their agents and their minimum age is 18. It doesn't say on SIS/MI6's site about specifics of degrees. The FBI is also stricter about drug use history, having a minimum clean time that's longer than MI6's (3 years versus 12 months).

While MI6 and MI5 both requires a person to have been in the UK for the past 9 out of the last 10 years, there are exceptions for that, including studying abroad or if you are representing the UK government. Shuichi would have been able to apply for MI6 and it would certainly have been easier.

Though, speaking of media, both MI6 and the FBI have a pretty good image. It's not like the CIA's image being extremely hit or miss. ;)

My guess is that he needed access to Kohji's case and that case, taking place in America with American citizens involved, would be under the FBI's jurisdiction. The CIA usually deals with outside of the US, MI5 is internal affairs for the UK, and MI6 wouldn't have access to the case because it doesn't appear to them to be connected to the UK.


Hmm... You're talking about the current requirements, but Shu joined the FBI several years ago. It could be that back then the requirements for foreigners were less strict, and that's why Shu was able to join. But I agree that it would be much easier for him to join a British agency, and since he didn't join it it must mean something.

But there is another explanation - Gosho couldn't care less about the requirements, and he made Shu joining the FBI, because he wanted him to be there. Even if in the real life joining him the FBI would be impossible.
Last edited by Spimer on January 19th, 2017, 5:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Fit the pieces together

Postby Tantei San » January 19th, 2017, 11:25 am

Spoiler:
Nemomon wrote:
PhantomWriter wrote:
Tantei San wrote:
Serinox wrote:
MeiTanteixX wrote:
Spimer wrote:Well, in the flashback case he said he was studying in the US to get the green card and eventually join the FBI or a similar org to figure out what happened to Tsutomu.

Before that he told Conan in the first ASACA case that his father was the reason he joined the FBI.

Maybe he got influenced by movie clichés or maybe the FBI was looking for a profile like his at the time.

or, once again, James was nice enough to offer his closest friend's son an opportunity to legally work on his father's case by having him join the FBI.

Assuming that James knew the Akai family through Tsutomu and not just through Shuichi.

But don't you think It would have been easier for him to join MI6, mother's in that organization and he is also british. He later became american.
There is a purpose of him joining FBI and also he went way too much to get a green card and meeting James Black. I would say he hasn't told the full truth, even to mary.


Not only that, regarding his citizenship, but the FBI has stricter standards. All special agents of the FBI require a four-year college degree, preferably in relation to a needed specialty, and three years of full-time work experience, along with being over 21 at the time of application. MI5 doesn't require a college degree for their agents and their minimum age is 18. It doesn't say on SIS/MI6's site about specifics of degrees. The FBI is also stricter about drug use history, having a minimum clean time that's longer than MI6's (3 years versus 12 months).

While MI6 and MI5 both requires a person to have been in the UK for the past 9 out of the last 10 years, there are exceptions for that, including studying abroad or if you are representing the UK government. Shuichi would have been able to apply for MI6 and it would certainly have been easier.

Though, speaking of media, both MI6 and the FBI have a pretty good image. It's not like the CIA's image being extremely hit or miss. ;)

My guess is that he needed access to Kohji's case and that case, taking place in America with American citizens involved, would be under the FBI's jurisdiction. The CIA usually deals with outside of the US, MI5 is internal affairs for the UK, and MI6 wouldn't have access to the case because it doesn't appear to them to be connected to the UK.


Hmm... You're talking about the current requirements, but Shu joined the FBI several years ago. It could be that back then the requirements for foreigners were less strict, and that's why Shu was able to join. But I agree that it would be much easier for him to join a British agency, and since he didn't join it it must mean something.

But there is another explanation - Gosho couldn't care less about the requirements, and he made Shu joining the FBI, because he wanted him to be there. Even if in the real life joining him the FBI could be impossible.



Shuichi joined BO 5 years ago. Even if it took him 3-4 years to get to a good rank, I don't think FBI would change their criteria in 10 years. I understand 10 years is a lot of time but still.

And I still would say, Shu joined FBI for a reason. Not because Gosho wanted or something. Though yes! I suppose the story demanded Shuu to be from FBI!

It would have been easier for him to join MI6.

But, what if both mary and Tsutomu were from FBI, we haven't seen much character development on Mary's part and one of the few things we know is that she was born in UK. (I am not saying she doesn't belong to UK or anything like that.)

And, besides we cannot ignore the existence of Elena Miyano.

Also, while going through the Rum Arc Timeline, I did read that "Shukichi stayed with his Non-Blood Brother Kohji Haneda". Mary and Masumi went back to UK, Akai went to US, leaving behind Shukichi.

There is a possibility that Kohji was adopted by Tsutomu and Mary, also it's possible that he's the eldest of all 4 of them. :o :o :o
Last edited by Spimer on January 19th, 2017, 5:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Improved the wording to make it easier to understand.
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Re: Fit the pieces together

Postby jimmy_kud0_tv2 » January 19th, 2017, 7:44 pm

Tantei San wrote:Also, while going through the Rum Arc Timeline, I did read that "Shukichi stayed with his Non-Blood Brother Kohji Haneda".


Where did you see this ?? Because Kohji was killed 17 years ago and there is no mention of him prior to that time.
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Re: Fit the pieces together

Postby PhantomWriter » January 19th, 2017, 10:02 pm

Nemomon wrote:
Spoiler:
PhantomWriter wrote:
Tantei San wrote:
Serinox wrote:
MeiTanteixX wrote:
Spimer wrote:Well, in the flashback case he said he was studying in the US to get the green card and eventually join the FBI or a similar org to figure out what happened to Tsutomu.

Before that he told Conan in the first ASACA case that his father was the reason he joined the FBI.

Maybe he got influenced by movie clichés or maybe the FBI was looking for a profile like his at the time.

or, once again, James was nice enough to offer his closest friend's son an opportunity to legally work on his father's case by having him join the FBI.

Assuming that James knew the Akai family through Tsutomu and not just through Shuichi.

But don't you think It would have been easier for him to join MI6, mother's in that organization and he is also british. He later became american.
There is a purpose of him joining FBI and also he went way too much to get a green card and meeting James Black. I would say he hasn't told the full truth, even to mary.


Not only that, regarding his citizenship, but the FBI has stricter standards. All special agents of the FBI require a four-year college degree, preferably in relation to a needed specialty, and three years of full-time work experience, along with being over 21 at the time of application. MI5 doesn't require a college degree for their agents and their minimum age is 18. It doesn't say on SIS/MI6's site about specifics of degrees. The FBI is also stricter about drug use history, having a minimum clean time that's longer than MI6's (3 years versus 12 months).

While MI6 and MI5 both requires a person to have been in the UK for the past 9 out of the last 10 years, there are exceptions for that, including studying abroad or if you are representing the UK government. Shuichi would have been able to apply for MI6 and it would certainly have been easier.

Though, speaking of media, both MI6 and the FBI have a pretty good image. It's not like the CIA's image being extremely hit or miss. ;)

My guess is that he needed access to Kohji's case and that case, taking place in America with American citizens involved, would be under the FBI's jurisdiction. The CIA usually deals with outside of the US, MI5 is internal affairs for the UK, and MI6 wouldn't have access to the case because it doesn't appear to them to be connected to the UK.


Hmm... You're talking about the current requirements, but Shu joined the FBI several years ago. It could be that back then the requirements for foreigners were less strict, and that's why Shu was able to join. But I agree that it would be much easier for him to join a British agency, and since he didn't join it it must mean something.

But there is another explanation - Gosho couldn't care less about the requirements, and he made Shu joining the FBI, because he wanted him to be there. Even if in the real life joining him the FBI would be impossible.


You misunderstand me. While I say it's harder for a person to join the FBI, both for him having to change his citizenship to join and the FBI having stricter requirements than MI6 for anybody applying as agents, it's not impossible. And, given what we know of Akai's skills, he could easily reach the other requirements. It's just that he has more hoops to jump through, joining the FBI instead of joining MI6.

Shuichi also mentions in the flashback the FBI's requirements as of the time in the setting, and how he is working on getting his citizenship in order and his plans to join them when he meets the full requirements. The FBI's requirements haven't changed all that much, except for loosening up some of the numbers about drug use recently, from what I could find.

Like I said, I think the reason for that is because of wanting access to Kohji's case files. The only national or international agencies that could claim jurisdiction on the case would be the FBI, given it taking place on US soil and involving a US citizen, and maybe the NPA, since it involves a Japanese citizen. However, the FBI would have better records of the event due to the location, the evidence would be more accessible because it took place on US soil, and the FBI has offices in other countries which would allow him more access to information and connections with other countries' police forces.
"It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts." -Sherlock Holmes
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Re: Fit the pieces together

Postby Tantei San » January 20th, 2017, 5:03 am

Spoiler:
You misunderstand me. While I say it's harder for a person to join the FBI, both for him having to change his citizenship to join and the FBI having stricter requirements than MI6 for anybody applying as agents, it's not impossible. And, given what we know of Akai's skills, he could easily reach the other requirements. It's just that he has more hoops to jump through, joining the FBI instead of joining MI6.

Shuichi also mentions in the flashback the FBI's requirements as of the time in the setting, and how he is working on getting his citizenship in order and his plans to join them when he meets the full requirements. The FBI's requirements haven't changed all that much, except for loosening up some of the numbers about drug use recently, from what I could find.

Like I said, I think the reason for that is because of wanting access to Kohji's case files. The only national or international agencies that could claim jurisdiction on the case would be the FBI, given it taking place on US soil and involving a US citizen, and maybe the NPA, since it involves a Japanese citizen. However, the FBI would have better records of the event due to the location, the evidence would be more accessible because it took place on US soil, and the FBI has offices in other countries which would allow him more access to information and connections with other countries' police forces.[/quote]


Shuichi did say he joined FBI to gain access to Kohji's case, And Like I said He wanted to because Kohji would be his Brother and also the Involvement of Tsutomu and since he disappeared right after that case, He wanted to find the truth behind all of that.
And as said by jimmy_kudo_tv2 I might have read wrong. Pardon.
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Re: Fit the pieces together

Postby DCUniverseAficionado » January 21st, 2017, 1:50 am

Tantei San wrote:IBesides as DCUniverseAficionado posted Regarding Akai knowing Ai/Shiho in an instant.


That was PhantomWriter's idea, not mine.

MeiTanteixX wrote:As for whether Akai knows about Mary's shrinking, it could go either way, since Mary could've made James promise to keep her situation a secret(even from her son, if James told her that he's alive), or Subaru could've been told by James (or known this from the start, depending on when her shrinking took place).


I think it was James who called Shuichi/Subaru at the end of Detectives' Nocturne (796–800/671–674)—remember, it still hasn't been officially revealed who called him or who called Masumi in File 800/Episode 674 (on that score, it's probably either Mary or Shukichi), while Vermouth called Rei/Toru/Bourbon. If that is indeed so, I wonder just what Shuichi/Subaru heard through that earpiece. Maybe James could've told Shuichi/Subaru something about his mother, during this call.
“Life is infinitely stranger than anything which the mind of man could invent. We would not dare to conceive the things which are really mere commonplaces of existence. If we could fly out of that window hand in hand, hover over this great city, gently remove the roofs, and and peep in at the queer things which are going on, the strange coincidences, the plannings, the cross-purposes, the wonderful chains of events, working through generations, and leading to the most outre results, it would make all fiction with its conventionalities and foreseen conclusions most stale and unprofitable.”
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Re: Fit the pieces together

Postby MeiTanteixX » January 21st, 2017, 8:48 pm

DCUniverseAficionado wrote:I think it was James who called Shuichi/Subaru at the end of Detectives' Nocturne (796–800/671–674)—remember, it still hasn't been officially revealed who called him or who called Masumi in File 800/Episode 674 (on that score, it's probably either Mary or Shukichi), while Vermouth called Rei/Toru/Bourbon. If that is indeed so, I wonder just what Shuichi/Subaru heard through that earpiece. Maybe James could've told Shuichi/Subaru something about his mother, during this call.

Oh yeah, that's right. Thanks for the recall.

Sera was probably in contact Mary. I feel like Sera only calls kichi-nii when she needs help with mysteries/puzzles.

Subaru... both Yukiko and James sounds like reasonable options, however, even if it was James, it doesn't necessarily mean that he told him about Mary of course.
DC's Awesome Qoutes:
Spoiler:
Image
Bourbon:''A child's curiosity and a detective's spirit of inquiry do have much in common''Image
Vermouth:''A secret makes a woman, woman''
Image Image
Mary/Gin:''It's like encountering a demon in the darkness...''
Image
Akai Shuichi:''Fear of death is worse than death itself''
Image
Shinichi Kudo:''following the smell of blood to arrive upon a crime scene, using every one of your senses to hunt the culprit, then once you've seized hold of him, sinking your sharp teeth(your evidence) until your opponent gives up the ghost, That's a detective''

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Re: Fit the pieces together

Postby DCUniverseAficionado » January 22nd, 2017, 6:59 pm

MeiTanteixX wrote:...however, even if it was James, it doesn't necessarily mean that he told him about Mary of course.


Certainly possible, but, if not, then what was he contacting Shuichi/Subaru for?

Ultimately, I'm just waiting for a flashback to this scene, in which the identities of the people who called Shuichi/Subaru and Masumi are finally revealed, after nearly 200 Files and over 5 years.
“Life is infinitely stranger than anything which the mind of man could invent. We would not dare to conceive the things which are really mere commonplaces of existence. If we could fly out of that window hand in hand, hover over this great city, gently remove the roofs, and and peep in at the queer things which are going on, the strange coincidences, the plannings, the cross-purposes, the wonderful chains of events, working through generations, and leading to the most outre results, it would make all fiction with its conventionalities and foreseen conclusions most stale and unprofitable.”
“Education never ends... it is a series of lessons, with the greatest for the last.”
― Arthur Conan Doyle, The Complete Adventures of Sherlock Holmes and His Last Bow
"I have decided to stick to love... hate is too great a burden to bear."
— Martin Luther King Jr. (A Testament of Hope: The Essential Writings and Speeches of Martin Luther King, Jr)
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Re: Fit the pieces together

Postby Tantei San » January 23rd, 2017, 8:43 am

DCUniverseAficionado wrote:
MeiTanteixX wrote:...however, even if it was James, it doesn't necessarily mean that he told him about Mary of course.


Certainly possible, but, if not, then what was he contacting Shuichi/Subaru for?

Ultimately, I'm just waiting for a flashback to this scene, in which the identities of the people who called Shuichi/Subaru and Masumi are finally revealed, after nearly 200 Files and over 5 years.

Do you think Gosho will create a flashback to Bourbon's unveiling After 5 years ??
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Re: Fit the pieces together

Postby PhantomWriter » January 23rd, 2017, 10:37 am

Tantei San wrote:
DCUniverseAficionado wrote:
MeiTanteixX wrote:...however, even if it was James, it doesn't necessarily mean that he told him about Mary of course.


Certainly possible, but, if not, then what was he contacting Shuichi/Subaru for?

Ultimately, I'm just waiting for a flashback to this scene, in which the identities of the people who called Shuichi/Subaru and Masumi are finally revealed, after nearly 200 Files and over 5 years.

Do you think Gosho will create a flashback to Bourbon's unveiling After 5 years ??


He's made random flashbacks of Shinichi and Ran doing things pretty unrelated to the main plot before, so it's not that he's averse to flashbacks. However, you have a point, since he doesn't generally do longer flashbacks about the plot, just snippets that allow us to put the pieces together or to hint at something (such as the whole affair with Scotch and Rei and Elena's interaction). When he does, Shinichi and Ran are a major part of it (the Golden Apple case in New York).
"It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts." -Sherlock Holmes

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