Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 963-965

Forum reserved for discussing specific points of the story—mostly from the manga. Be warned, these discussions will be current with the manga and will spoil many plot lines for anime-centric fans.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 963-96X

Postby Spimer » June 18th, 2016, 5:15 pm

@kentasaiba:
The Crow Society never existed: that was a mistranslation of the name Karasuma Renya. Unless you mean the BO.
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ThatLee4
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 963-96X

Postby ThatLee4 » June 19th, 2016, 6:45 pm

Gosho really needs to start linking seemingly irrivant plots riddles to the main BO plot. In a long overall investigation case the readers and Conan put together.

It would had been beautiful if the tine was the 7 crows tune was used in this. Which then went on to give Conan and Ai a small hint to why the BO used it and their main plan with forshadowing once revealed fully.

This would make it a true detective manga.

Rather than just random cases (like 85% of cases that could be in any order really) just sometime indepthly can be solved by research and forshadowing. Rather than a bizzar way to use something and firguring out who had a dumb grudge to kill someone.

This make Gosho look a poor writer. Which he is not.

But he could tie in wgat it looked like he was doing with the RUM investigation with the cases around his mystery like how descrpitions can be misleading.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 963-96X

Postby Serinox » June 19th, 2016, 8:00 pm

ThatLee4 wrote:Gosho really needs to start linking seemingly irrivant plots riddles to the main BO plot. In a long overall investigation case the readers and Conan put together.

It would had been beautiful if the tine was the 7 crows tune was used in this. Which then went on to give Conan and Ai a small hint to why the BO used it and their main plan with forshadowing once revealed fully.

This would make it a true detective manga.

Rather than just random cases (like 85% of cases that could be in any order really) just sometime indepthly can be solved by research and forshadowing. Rather than a bizzar way to use something and firguring out who had a dumb grudge to kill someone.

This make Gosho look a poor writer. Which he is not.

But he could tie in wgat it looked like he was doing with the RUM investigation with the cases around his mystery like how descrpitions can be misleading.

Normal cases are the bread and butter of a procedural crime series though. DC is just not a manga where everything revolves around the main plot. Also, what would having Nanatsu no Ko play in the music box here achieve? They both already know its meaning as the phone number. To make them think about the BO again? No need for the song to just randomly play in the music box, Conan and Haibara don't really need a cue to think about the BO, they often do it without one. To foreshadow that the next case is a BO case? Okay, would be cool, but just having the next case be a BO case without the song playing wouldn't make much of a difference. It's not like Nanatsu no Ko still offers any mystery to the reader or Conan & Haibara, that was solved ages ago.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 963-96X

Postby ShinRan4ver » June 19th, 2016, 9:50 pm

Serinox wrote:
ThatLee4 wrote:Gosho really needs to start linking seemingly irrivant plots riddles to the main BO plot. In a long overall investigation case the readers and Conan put together.

It would had been beautiful if the tine was the 7 crows tune was used in this. Which then went on to give Conan and Ai a small hint to why the BO used it and their main plan with forshadowing once revealed fully.

This would make it a true detective manga.

Rather than just random cases (like 85% of cases that could be in any order really) just sometime indepthly can be solved by research and forshadowing. Rather than a bizzar way to use something and firguring out who had a dumb grudge to kill someone.

This make Gosho look a poor writer. Which he is not.

But he could tie in wgat it looked like he was doing with the RUM investigation with the cases around his mystery like how descrpitions can be misleading.

Normal cases are the bread and butter of a procedural crime series though. DC is just not a manga where everything revolves around the main plot. Also, what would having Nanatsu no Ko play in the music box here achieve? They both already know its meaning as the phone number. To make them think about the BO again? No need for the song to just randomly play in the music box, Conan and Haibara don't really need a cue to think about the BO, they often do it without one. To foreshadow that the next case is a BO case? Okay, would be cool, but just having the next case be a BO case without the song playing wouldn't make much of a difference. It's not like Nanatsu no Ko still offers any mystery to the reader or Conan & Haibara, that was solved ages ago.



I think Nanatsu no Ko could serve as a way to reveal "Subaru" as Kid, since as Akai would naturally react to that tone whereas Kid wouldn't really.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 963-96X

Postby Serinox » June 19th, 2016, 10:43 pm

ShinRan4ver wrote:
Serinox wrote:
ThatLee4 wrote:Gosho really needs to start linking seemingly irrivant plots riddles to the main BO plot. In a long overall investigation case the readers and Conan put together.

It would had been beautiful if the tine was the 7 crows tune was used in this. Which then went on to give Conan and Ai a small hint to why the BO used it and their main plan with forshadowing once revealed fully.

This would make it a true detective manga.

Rather than just random cases (like 85% of cases that could be in any order really) just sometime indepthly can be solved by research and forshadowing. Rather than a bizzar way to use something and firguring out who had a dumb grudge to kill someone.

This make Gosho look a poor writer. Which he is not.

But he could tie in wgat it looked like he was doing with the RUM investigation with the cases around his mystery like how descrpitions can be misleading.

Normal cases are the bread and butter of a procedural crime series though. DC is just not a manga where everything revolves around the main plot. Also, what would having Nanatsu no Ko play in the music box here achieve? They both already know its meaning as the phone number. To make them think about the BO again? No need for the song to just randomly play in the music box, Conan and Haibara don't really need a cue to think about the BO, they often do it without one. To foreshadow that the next case is a BO case? Okay, would be cool, but just having the next case be a BO case without the song playing wouldn't make much of a difference. It's not like Nanatsu no Ko still offers any mystery to the reader or Conan & Haibara, that was solved ages ago.

I think Nanatsu no Ko could serve as a way to reveal "Subaru" as Kid, since as Akai would naturally react to that tone whereas Kid wouldn't really.

Hm, but the thing is, the way the case is goign atm, Kid should be demasked before the box is opened or he will open it after already having revealed himself. Also, Akai would try to hide his reaction in front of Haibara anyway, not that I think there'd be a strong reaction anyway, it wouldn't also make him jump or anything.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 963-96X

Postby k11chi » June 20th, 2016, 12:00 am

ThatLee4 wrote:Gosho really needs to start linking seemingly irrivant plots riddles to the main BO plot. In a long overall investigation case the readers and Conan put together.

It would had been beautiful if the tine was the 7 crows tune was used in this. Which then went on to give Conan and Ai a small hint to why the BO used it and their main plan with forshadowing once revealed fully.

This would make it a true detective manga.

Rather than just random cases (like 85% of cases that could be in any order really) just sometime indepthly can be solved by research and forshadowing. Rather than a bizzar way to use something and firguring out who had a dumb grudge to kill someone.

This make Gosho look a poor writer. Which he is not.

But he could tie in wgat it looked like he was doing with the RUM investigation with the cases around his mystery like how descrpitions can be misleading.
The entire premise of the story is Conan solving cases and sometimes coming across to clues to the BO. He's a detective so the series does need normal cases completely unrelated to the cast of characters. The writing doesn't get affected by continuity to the rest of the series, you can tell when the writing sucks and when it doesn't with common sense and actually reading the files.

In this case Nanatsu no ko is nothing more than the ringtone that sounds when you type the boss's number in. It has no actual plot relevance other than figuring out the number.
ThatLee4
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 963-96X

Postby ThatLee4 » June 20th, 2016, 4:14 am

You guys are missing my point with the use of Nanatsu no Ko. We know it is the dialtone for the BO.

But other mysteries where about if the meaning of the song is linked to the BO plan. Like with the number 7 and the leader etc. We dontbeven know what the orgs real name is.

But maybe this is nothing. Just another random seperate pont Gosho made?

All im saying is Gosho drags out the story with like 8% plot for the whole series most mystries are not as intersting as they could be. It is mostly misdirection of similar characters, with us figuring out who is who being his fortè writing style. Which was good in the Vermont arch. But now is cheesy.

As a mystery/detective manga i expect better improvements for a reader to keep the story strong. Not just random murders dramas and romance links.

Switch it up a bit. Have some murders prevented. Have code breaking (not just the bait Kanji number thing). Hijackings, deciet. And a higher sense of danger.

Coz to many people complain the manga is written badly as we know how good Gosho can be. But he has made this into a very basic detective manga. For want of longevity
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 963-96X

Postby Spimer » June 22nd, 2016, 5:45 am

Details about the case:
Spoiler:
. Sonoko comments that the huge ammount of books reminds her of Shinichi's library and Conan admits that he got the same feeling

. Kogoro complains that Jirokichi should've searched them before calling them in and he replies that he spent almost a whole day with the staff looking at ALL books but they didn't find the memo

. Okiya asks the widow if maybe her late husband changed the memo's hiding place but she finds it unlikely since he died in a car accident a few days ago and surely couldn't predict a happening like that

Okiya: "But nevertheless your husband hasn't opened the box in 10 years, is that not right?"
Widow: "Didn't open when I was around. It'd seem he rather opened it when I wasn't at home."

. There was something her husband always said whenever she returned home from some errand

Husband: "Looks like you still haven't been able to open the box... I stuffed the memo with the instructions in the same page so... If you found it... You'd be able to find the true contents of the box yet... It'd seem it was too heavy of a burden for you. But if you REALLY want to see them... I'll tell you the book in which I hid the memo... It's a bit shameful, though."

. Okiya asks if there could be something else apart from the stone but the widow has no idea of what it could be: Sonoko argues that if he was going to tell her she could've asked him yet the wife thought it'd be a humiliation since he was so sure she wouldn't find it

. Come to these it could be that it's a book which she normally wouldn't read like those her husband liked: mystery novels and monster tales

. Kogoro's coughs worsen and Ran tells him to drink the medicine in the toilet: Haibara adds that there's a drink vending machine in the lobby: Agasa and Conan also go there

. In the meanwhile Jirokichi has posted a notice in the library (open to the public) saying he'll reward whoever manages to open the box with 1 million yen (aprox. 9.575 USD) but any challenger can only interact with the box for 5 minutes

. Conan watches a ton of people attempt in vain to open it: Agasa comes back and Conan complains he takes too long to which he replies he doesn't feel well and fears Kogoro's cold is affecting him too: despite that both are alone he calls him "Conan - kun" instead of "Shinichi - kun" which he always does when Kogoro and the others aren't around

. Kogoro attemps to challenge the box: he also tries to jump a couple meters away from the table but the cage accurately drops into his location as well: it's got a robot arm that allows it to change position

. The widow spots that the box got wet and she quickly takes it from him to wipe it while muttering that it'll be a disaster if water entered the insides of it, surprising Agasa & Conan

. Conan and the other 2 return to the store-room and find that only Okiya and Haibara are there: Okiya says Ran and Sonoko went to the toilet too: they haven't found the paper yet and Okiya is interested in some mystery novels he didn't know of while Haibara yawns, bored

. The widow comes in and notices that Okiya has the smell of the stew he readied before: the widow says that she's good at making stews, her husband loved them, and her husband's mother taught her the recipe, and that her husband bought her several cooking books which she's read over and over again: Kogoro suggests skipping those altogether

. The 2 girls come back and Ran notices Sonoko's put on make-up to appeal in front of Kid

. Haibara suggests that even if Kid shows up he'll surely be stopped by the anti-theft device and and the box's tricks and will be unable to steal the jewel

Kid (thinking): "I wonder 'bout that!"

. Conan notices Kid's "presence" very close by and begins to think who in the room it could be:

. Kogoro stopped coughing ever since he came back from the toilet
. Akai/Okiya is paying more attention to the surroundings than the book he's reading
. Agasa spent too much time in the toilet
. Jirokichi and the widow can be discarded: Jirokichi has the cage's remote and could've swapped the box at any time
while the widow wouldn't have gotten nervous when the box got wet
. Kid has disguised as either Ran or Sonoko before but they could be told apart by their height since they're more or less Agasa's height

. Ran sees a book which calls her attention but can't reach it so she climbs into a chair Sonoko holds: despite that Ran almost doesn't reach it and stretches so Conan looks at her one-piece dress and thinks he can almost see her panties but then thinks it could be Kid disguised as well

. Conan comes closer and decides that Ran's thighs are the usual size so it's the real one alright

Haibara: "Talk about a good sight... You look like a kid but you're a perv old man in the inside... You lewd..."
Conan: "Ah, no... I'm just making sure it's not Kid in disguise..."
Haibara (not convinced): "Super lewd."
Conan: "Well! Sorry for being a lewd, man!"

. Conan gets serious again and asks her if he noticed Kid's presence and she says that anyone but Okiya could be Kid: he's the only one who hasn't come out the room in all this time

. Conan thinks that Kid could've disguised as him and then come to the library: everyone feels suspicious again

. The widow then brings up that she and her husband shared an "exchange diary" when they were students but that diary was odd:
. Their deal was that she'd write the right page and the husband would write the left page
. The widow used to write the day's happenings and what she thought of her husband but it didn't fit in a single page
. The husband wrote in a cocked manner that would take about 3 pages to write what he wanted to write in the left page
. But despite that he only wrote a few columns
. Back then she thought the husband was a poor correspondent: but after marrying she found the diary on his desk one day
. She picked it to re-read it and remember her young times: but as she read it she found crooked writing taking about 2 pages she'd never seen before
. Afterwards the husband took it up and she hasn't read it again

. As a result the widow wonders if that's related to the hiding place of the memo

. Kogoro suggests that maybe some pages got glued because the husband could've been eating rice balls while reading it and the grains of rice could've gotten stuck between the pages

. Conan then reminds some statements by the widow:
. "My husband was very shy"
. "My husband's mother taught me the recipe in person, you know?"
. "If water got inside..."
. "That diary was very odd"
. "If you found that paper then you should be able to find the box's true contents too yet..."

. Conan suddenly seems to link all of the pieces together and grins

. Kid sees that from close by and grins as well

Kid: "Oho. That face... Looks like you've figured it out, too... Detective. The paper's location... The box's true contents as well..."
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 963-96X

Postby DCUniverseAficionado » June 22nd, 2016, 6:06 pm

Spoiler:
Seems that Agasa is even more likely to be Kid, since he called Shinichi/Conan just "Conan" when they were alone...

What will give away Kid's disguise as Agasa is, most likely, the band-aids on his fingers. Since 964 showed "Agasa's" right hand after coming out of the bathroom, I compared it with the panel in 963 that showed the real Agasa's right hand:

File 963, Page 9
Image

File 964, Page 6
Image

Looks like Kid messed up with the thumb and index finger—the band-aid on the thumb is lower and the one on the index finger is higher.
“Life is infinitely stranger than anything which the mind of man could invent. We would not dare to conceive the things which are really mere commonplaces of existence. If we could fly out of that window hand in hand, hover over this great city, gently remove the roofs, and and peep in at the queer things which are going on, the strange coincidences, the plannings, the cross-purposes, the wonderful chains of events, working through generations, and leading to the most outre results, it would make all fiction with its conventionalities and foreseen conclusions most stale and unprofitable.”
“Education never ends... it is a series of lessons, with the greatest for the last.”
― Arthur Conan Doyle, The Complete Adventures of Sherlock Holmes and His Last Bow
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 963-96X

Postby Shihœiji » June 23rd, 2016, 3:39 am

Good searching! I pointed Agasa as the sole suspect plausible: Okiya were not there and is too suspicious, Ran's legs are the same in the expert's opinion, Sonoko was used in his last appearence by Kid, Kogoro immediately stopped his coughs and Ai is too small.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 963-96X

Postby broken english » June 25th, 2016, 3:39 am

i think kid knocked subaru in shinichi house. He disguise oneself as subaru. The paper can find with smell nikujaga beetween books. Inside karakuri box are diary.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 963-96X

Postby DCUniverseAficionado » June 25th, 2016, 4:32 am

Spoiler:
965 text spoilers are out:
http://tamae.2ch.net/test/read.cgi/ymag/1466456964/533

Break next week.
“Life is infinitely stranger than anything which the mind of man could invent. We would not dare to conceive the things which are really mere commonplaces of existence. If we could fly out of that window hand in hand, hover over this great city, gently remove the roofs, and and peep in at the queer things which are going on, the strange coincidences, the plannings, the cross-purposes, the wonderful chains of events, working through generations, and leading to the most outre results, it would make all fiction with its conventionalities and foreseen conclusions most stale and unprofitable.”
“Education never ends... it is a series of lessons, with the greatest for the last.”
― Arthur Conan Doyle, The Complete Adventures of Sherlock Holmes and His Last Bow
"I have decided to stick to love... hate is too great a burden to bear."
— Martin Luther King Jr. (A Testament of Hope: The Essential Writings and Speeches of Martin Luther King, Jr)
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 963-96X

Postby Spimer » June 25th, 2016, 6:31 am

Translation of the text spoilers:

BREAK NEXT WEEK

Spoiler:
File 965: Diary

Conan's figured out the trick so he gathers everyone to recreate it.

He borrows a pen and a notebook from Okiya: he torns off an empty page and tears it into small pieces: he writes a circle in (each pieces') front and rear and makes Kogoro remember those before he stuffs those into the notebook.

It looks like you'll be able to find them at once but they don't appear when others check the notebook: if you take a closer look at it you see that that the edge of the page where Conan stuffed the circles is slightly torn and the papers will jump off the page when you flip it: there's a similar trick to the exchange diary: since the widow fully opened the pages when re-reading it she avoided this trap.

So: which of the books is the right one? It's the one the widow doesn't need to read: the page with the potato and meat stew recipe: since her late husband's mother told her the recipe herself there was no need to read it up on the cooking book: Kogoro begins to wrestle with the heap of books...

... There's a sudden blackout and the sound of a music box playing "Grandfather's clock" rings out: the emergency lights go on and they see that Kid's card is stabbed into the trick box: Jirokichi wants to chase Kid but the widow stops him saying it'd be inelegant: she says that something far more precious and full of memories than the jewel should be left inside.

When the widow suggests checking out what's inside Agasa suddenly says he's got stomach ache and runs off to the toilet: turns out he was Kid: what gave him away was that he never called Conan as "Conan-kun" when they were alone (he actually says "Shinichi-kun"). Conan spotted that the fingers' bandages were in different positions too which also gave him away.

Conan also found odd that Agasa could pick a book which Ran didn't reach even by climbing into a seat despite that Agasa and Ran are supposed to be of the same height: Conan guesses the box hasn't actually been opened: since the box is from the 19th century the song "Grandfather's clock" wasn't used back then.

It'd seem that when Kid, accepting the challenge, came to the library yet he'd actually met the late husband in one ocassion time ago and saw the jewel before he shut the box: the jewel was but an add-on and the actual contents are the famed exchange diary.

So Kid is about to leave without doing anything but Okiya is keeping the toilet's stall door locked from the outside: the picture that Kid took of Okiya before coming to the library seems to show something Okiya doesn't want others to see.

So Kid leaves his smartphone there and makes his escape: and it'd seem he got stuck for 12 hours to avoid the police's search for him afterwards.

Side-note: "Even Kid shuddered and got intimidated by Subaru - san... He successfully retrieved the photograph. Sunday #33 will have a new series starring the Detective Boys. Next week will have a break for the author to gather materials. To be continued in Issue #33."
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 963-96X

Postby MrDetective » June 25th, 2016, 1:28 pm

Spimer wrote:BREAK NEXT WEEK


sigh

Spimer wrote:Sunday #33 will have a new series starring the Detective Boys.


big sigh
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 963-965

Postby AICHAN » June 25th, 2016, 2:41 pm

People seems to forget how many times we had plot related clues during DB cases.As long as it's not about Naeko/Chiba I'm ok with a DB case.
Spoiler:
[spoiler]Image

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