Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 894-898: Scarlet Series!

Forum reserved for discussing specific points of the story—mostly from the manga. Be warned, these discussions will be current with the manga and will spoil many plot lines for anime-centric fans.
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Mikasa

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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 894-???: Scarlet Series!

Post by Mikasa »

There's something that i spotted in the poster which waka posted
Spoiler:
There is one panel which might be a spoiler for file 895 where okiya and amuro are seen together with conan peeking behind okiya. Amuro is wearing the same clothes he's seen wearing in file 894 and okiya too is wearing the same clothes that he wore in 894. If you look closely in the right side of the poster u can find it. Okiya might or might not be wearing his mask. Can someone confirm it because i might be wrong. :-\
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PhantomWriter
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 894-???: Scarlet Series!

Post by PhantomWriter »

Mikasa wrote:There's something that i spotted in the poster which waka posted
Spoiler:
There is one panel which might be a spoiler for file 895 where okiya and amuro are seen together with conan peeking behind okiya. Amuro is wearing the same clothes he's seen wearing in file 894 and okiya too is wearing the same clothes that he wore in 894. If you look closely in the right side of the poster u can find it. Okiya might or might not be wearing his mask. Can someone confirm it because i might be wrong. :-\
Good eye! It looks like the cover page, though.
Spoiler:
By the way, I then looked at the Facebook page version on full screen. There is no mask, and they are wearing their clothes from 894.
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RoboG55
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 894-???: Scarlet Series!

Post by RoboG55 »

PhantomWriter wrote:
Mikasa wrote:There's something that i spotted in the poster which waka posted
Spoiler:
There is one panel which might be a spoiler for file 895 where okiya and amuro are seen together with conan peeking behind okiya. Amuro is wearing the same clothes he's seen wearing in file 894 and okiya too is wearing the same clothes that he wore in 894. If you look closely in the right side of the poster u can find it. Okiya might or might not be wearing his mask. Can someone confirm it because i might be wrong. :-\
Good eye! It looks like the cover page, though.
Spoiler:
By the way, I then looked at the Facebook page version on full screen. There is no mask, and they are wearing their clothes from 894.
It most certainly looks like it's the cover pager for one of the chapters. Maybe I should look around for it just in case?
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Mikasa

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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 894-???: Scarlet Series!

Post by Mikasa »

Spoiler:
I also thought that he might not be wearing the mask but since the mask is actually white i thought maybe he is wearing it. The picture is not that clear afterall.
asanez2008

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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 894-???: Scarlet Series!

Post by asanez2008 »

PhantomWriter wrote:
Yuki_JX wrote:Probably she will be aware or probably not in whole, but we all knew that this case only happened because of Jodie & Camel (their fault) and Conan may oblige and force them both to do this without questions right?

The implication of double disguises is that Amuro (he smart don't underestimate him) will probably starting thinking the real gain/reason/objective the poser and Amuro may doubt more and more.

Like the post on the other thread "viewtopic.php?f=5&t=12255" in my opinion it implies/hinted that the poser is a female and an amateur in disguise perfectly fits to Jodie.
I'm not underestimating Amuro. I'm aware he would be suspicious about it. And if he gets grabby, it's not like Hattori first taking off the bandage disguise, then the Shinichi disguise. Amuro's likely going to yank and use more force that could damage a disguise underneath and make it obvious that there's another disguise.

I'm also leaning toward the disguiser being female or a younger/teenage male.

Mask Subaru cannot be certain characters due to body proportions:
  • Agasa: Too wide and definitely too short.
  • Yuusaku: Too broad in the shoulders.
  • Camel: Too broad in the shoulders and his face shape aren't right.
  • James: Too broad in the shoulders.
There are other characters ruled out due to undue danger to themselves:
  • Haibara: mentally noted stuff about this being outside her area, Agasa and Conan have been keeping it secret from her, and handing her over to Amuro to save Akai would make Akai violent, as that's in violation of Akai's whole promise to Akemi. On top of that, they just got out of the Mystery Train mess recently, so suddenly someone in the Org. that isn't Vermouth realizing both Akai and Shiho are alive would be doubly a bad situation.
  • Conan: Bad idea. REALLY bad idea. Shinichi Kudou is supposed to be dead. Add in how Haibara's not involved, meaning it's unlikely a temporary antidote involved, and this is simply not going to work.
  • Unknown Child: Even assuming they are the real Subaru shrunken by APTX and Akai is in contact with him, that would require revealing to Conan and Haibara that he's shrunken. I also don't think Akai would let his brother put himself in danger like that.
  • Hattori: Aside from it already being done before from a meta standpoint, there's the issue of how he's done this disguising before when dealing with the Org. in the story. If there becomes a recurring theme that Hattori is consistently disguising and involved in Black Org. related messes, the Org. is going to put the pieces together.
  • Yukiko: As discussed earlier by someone else, the Org. aside from Vermouth doesn't know the anti-Org. side has a disguiser. That is a vital piece of both the Halloween ship case and the Bell Tree train case. If Amuro gets confirmation that they do, even if he's already only suspicious, their machinations become clearer. Then it opens up the possibility that Hattori collaborated with someone that was anti-Org. to help them and that the Sherry on the train wasn't actually Sherry, meaning she's still alive.
Meanwhile, KID is eliminated due to logistical issues: They wouldn't have the time to track him down in one day and he wouldn't agree to it after the end of Mystery Train because of how he nearly got murdered. And it's the same guy he'd be confronting, which would probably freak him out still. From a meta standpoint, Gosho said KID wouldn't be involved in Org. cases.

Though one could argue it'd be a good idea to have Camel disguise as Subaru and maintain the shoulder and limb proportions, his overall face shape is much more blocky and that'd raise more eyebrows from Amuro than differing shoulder proportions. Meanwhile, James and Yuusaku have facial hair, which could complicate a disguise. Thus far, with the disguised we've seen, they've always been lacking in facial hair: Hattori, Conan, KID, Yukiko, Vermouth, Akai, and Amuro. They also still don't match who we see that's dressed as Subaru.
how about Sera? you failed to mention her! she might be the one we're looking for or something.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 894-???: Scarlet Series!

Post by PhantomWriter »

I'm ruling her out for the same reason as Unknown Child: No way Akai would permit his civilian relatives to put themselves in danger like that for his gain. On top of that, Sera's personality wouldn't be conducive for this sort of situation. She's a bit of a wild card.

Also on top of that: she'd have to be suddenly informed of the situation, which is again something Akai wouldn't do. He keeps civilians out of these affairs when he can, like with how Eisuke was removed to prevent him from hearing more about the Black Organization. If they aren't neck-deep into the mess like Conan or himself, even if they're blood relations of people involved, they aren't allowed to know.

On top of that, if Amuro gets grabby, it would be a very bad idea and would put Sera, the unknown child, the middle brother (if he's not the unknown child), and possibly their mother (if she's not the unknown child) also in danger. Remember that Sera's got the unknown child in her care. On top of that, if Amuro gets into his head that more than just Shuichi is involved with fighting the Black Organization in that family, that would be incredibly bad.
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RoboG55
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 894-???: Scarlet Series!

Post by RoboG55 »

PhantomWriter wrote:I'm ruling her out for the same reason as Unknown Child: No way Akai would permit his civilian relatives to put themselves in danger like that for his gain. On top of that, Sera's personality wouldn't be conducive for this sort of situation. She's a bit of a wild card.

Also on top of that: she'd have to be suddenly informed of the situation, which is again something Akai wouldn't do. He keeps civilians out of these affairs when he can, like with how Eisuke was removed to prevent him from hearing more about the Black Organization. If they aren't neck-deep into the mess like Conan or himself, even if they're blood relations of people involved, they aren't allowed to know.

On top of that, if Amuro gets grabby, it would be a very bad idea and would put Sera, the unknown child, the middle brother (if he's not the unknown child), and possibly their mother (if she's not the unknown child) also in danger. Remember that Sera's got the unknown child in her care. On top of that, if Amuro gets into his head that more than just Shuichi is involved with fighting the Black Organization in that family, that would be incredibly bad.
I agree; Akai isn't the kind of person who'd let others (Civilians, particularly his relatives) be put in danger, either willingly or unknowingly, to benefit him. It has indeed been shown in multiple cases that demonstrate this. One of those instances is during Black Impact, when he stopped shooting at Gin because innocent people might get hurt. He was fully capable of continuing (there'd be some benefit, I'm sure), but he didn't do so. But then again, it's pretty typical for him, as an FBI agent, to make sure nobody innocent is harmed in the process of doing his job. :P
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Jd-
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 894-???: Scarlet Series!

Post by Jd- »

Here's the full-sized version:

Image
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Yuki_JX

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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 894-???: Scarlet Series!

Post by Yuki_JX »

AICHAN wrote:I really doubt it's Jodie,mostly because Conan keeps secrets from her and Camel about Akai fake death,and they did so many mistakes with Amuro that it would surprised me if Conan asked jodie's help...
For now I think it's Yusaku,because if Gosho mentions him somewhere in the file,that means he'll have a role in this case(like kid during the MT case). Yukiko is a master of deguises,she can solve the problem of facial hair easily.And I don't see any issues with his shoulders.
After all Yusaku is the only one who can surpass shinichi in terms of detective skills.
Conan will not ask Jodie, but oblige to do it because to begin with its Jodie's fault. We must remember that any leaked classified information is very vital to both parties (FBI and BO). Any FBI agent will not surely pass this without making a move.

Also like I always pointing out Yusaku and Yukiko have no gain/motive/objective/reason
to pose as Subaru in Amuro's perspective. It will only makes Amuro more suspicious of their true objectives.

In Manga the ratio of the body in a drawing dictates if it is a man, a women, a child, an adult etc. In Mask Subaru case, the ratio is for a female adult.

Facial hair can be solved by just shaving. hello??
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 894-???: Scarlet Series!

Post by PhantomWriter »

Jd- wrote:Here's the full-sized version:

Image
Thanks! And it's clear that Subaru isn't wearing a mask in that panel. It's also possible that it's a cover page for a file after 895 instead of 895 itself, considering the mask needs to come off at some point in the manga.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 894-???: Scarlet Series!

Post by asanez2008 »

so your saying that Akai will never allow anyone to help them because of the risk involve? please lets not rule everyone out yet.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 894-???: Scarlet Series!

Post by Okiyakaivan »

If Amuro find out that Subaru is Akai, it could be a problem around him?
Spoiler:
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 894-???: Scarlet Series!

Post by RoboG55 »

asanez2008 wrote:so your saying that Akai will never allow anyone to help them because of the risk involve? please lets not rule everyone out yet.
Not everyone, of course. He didn't stop Conan when he said he wanted to help, even when Akai had warned him of the consequences. It's not like you can't help, end of story. He at least warns them of the possible consequences of their actions (because it's the BO we're dealing with here!), but he's not going to stop people who are truly willing to aid them, even when they know of what might happen to them and everyone around them.
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asanez2008

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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 894-???: Scarlet Series!

Post by asanez2008 »

RoboG55 wrote:
asanez2008 wrote:so your saying that Akai will never allow anyone to help them because of the risk involve? please lets not rule everyone out yet.
Not everyone, of course. He didn't stop Conan when he said he wanted to help, even when Akai had warned him of the consequences. It's not like you can't help, end of story. He at least warns them of the possible consequences of their actions (because it's the BO we're dealing with here!), but he's not going to stop people who are truly willing to aid them, even when they know of what might happen to them and everyone around them.
i know right? there's also Kaito kid who help them during bell train chapters and nearly died but everyone here probably forgot.
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 894-???: Scarlet Series!

Post by PhantomWriter »

asanez2008 wrote:so your saying that Akai will never allow anyone to help them because of the risk involve? please lets not rule everyone out yet.
No, that's not what I'm saying. There's a difference between not allowing any help at all and noting that there'd be more risk than normal for the person. And keep in mind that, though it would also protect Kir, the primary person being protected right now is Akai himself. He's not the kind of person that would put his family in danger like this to save himself, especially since he's the eldest sibling. Speaking as a sibling, I can tell you there's no way in hell that I'd put my little brother or older sister in danger like that to save my own hide. And there's no way my older sister would leave either my brother or me out to dry like that. Unless someone's a total asshole and hates their siblings, they're not going to put their siblings in that sort of danger like that.

The others eliminated are due to how it'd be a bad idea due to logistics and put them in extra danger: Shiho and Shinichi are supposed to be dead, so them disguising as Subaru and being revealed if/when Amuro gets grabby is just makes it more obvious that faked deaths are something the anti-Org side does. Heiji's disguised before in an Org. confrontation, so it becoming a pattern with him would paint a target on his backs. Yukiko confronting anyone other than Vermouth reveals that the anti-Org side can pull off disguising, which means they lose an advantage and calls into question other confrontations. And so on.

As for KID's inclusion, I have no idea. It always came across to me as something Conan did last minute, which explains what Akai did last minute when the explosives in the carriage were found out.
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