Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 894-898: Scarlet Series!

[MeiTanteixX]

Im not sure where this Borbon arch is heading. It seemed to haveva lot of potential. And still does. But it seems to have lost its sence of danger to Conan and his side, and i dont really like the involvement of his dad being Okiya, if he is.

But that being said we have not yet reached 900 where i believe something really big will happen.

But what:
Amouro vs Akia revealed?
Amouro x Ai conversation (hopefully some stuff about the tapes and the BO's true plan)?
Conan x Amouro team up/showdown?
Other BO member- Gin, Vodka. And Kir's mission?

What do you guys think?

I'd say the central point of this series is as the name states, "the SCARLET series", where as scarlet can be interpreted as Akai(scarlet=red(-ish)=akai). Though there might be extra information revealed about the BO or the members, I think it will most likely focus on Akai, and just like the next chapter states, i Think Akai will actually reveal himself in the next chapter "Scarlet Return"(not necessarily as him being okiya though). As to what will happen next, that will drag Akai's showdown to chapter 900, will have to wait and see!!

EDIT: Scarlet was actually a pretty smart and fitting name for the series, considering that it's, besides meaning "Akai", a reference to the Conan Doyle's first Holmes novel! gotta admire the name!! ^^

[Kor]

There certainly are people who only make an account (to any site) to say something like "story is sucks me hate"

I can't recall many instances of people who create an account here only to say the story sucks. The majority of instances of people who create an account here but only post several posts seemed to be concerned more with episode/movie releases.

[MeiTanteixX]

There certainly are people who only make an account (to any site) to say something like "story is sucks me hate"

i can agree on that part k11chi, i get infact disgusted by that behavior!!!

[AICHAN]

@thatlee:
Gosho promised us that we would know Amuro real name and the reason why Elena appear in flashback,so I guess that will happen after his confrontation with the real Akai.

I think Amuro will realize he's not talking to the right person,so he'll back off a little bit.He could act as if Conan's plan worked well,but prepare something to catch the real Akai.
Hopefully Amuro will use Sera as a bait and be more violent than he is now.Amuro knows Agasa is involved with Akai,so maybe he'll do something to Agasa and Ai(I hope so,in order to have a discussion concerning Elena).Using civilian people as a bait to catch Akai is more efficent than using his FBI friends,IMO.(since they have experience,they can escape,use guns...)
For now I don't feel any danger,even for the FBI.I have the feeling Amuro is just bluffing...anyway we'll have to wait and see...

[k11chi]

One problem with this fandom seems to be that they take these groups thoughts and deductions and make it their own... Quite literally actually, it's easy to think that "I think this way" when you can't think for yourself and let other peoples opinions affect your own.

As Kor said above, I've not really seen this kind of thing happen too often, especially in a negative way.

If you actually care and want to check that out, you can always ask for proof and see if they can direct you to their posts or something similar that contain more than Cheks quotes or something...

What's important to remember here is that, of course, not everyone posts everything that comes to mind (and naturally not all discussion occurs here). For example, hours into the day that the Akai death file came out, Knightus and I said in conversation: "That's definitely Rikumichi's body". By the end of Okiya's introduction, we were both independently sure: "That's Akai." When Sera was introduced, in that very first case, we had both concluded: "Yep, this is Akai's sister." By the time Amuro appeared, we knew he was Bourbon without any question--not just due to the usual way that a special character is introduced, but also because the Gundam connection was obvious (Akai's namesake being the bad guy of Gundam, now the good guy's name shows up?). One of the translators here had predicted this exact thing would happen years earlier, but even without that, people were piecing it together very quickly.

All told, while big theories are important and everything, after this many files and episodes, a lot of people are conditioned to recognize the patterns employed by certain repeated ideas. Some don't take the time to individually analyze each file for how it adds up to the sum, but may already realize, "Yeah, Akai faked his death" and feel satisfied in that conclusion without confirming each detail.

A recent example of us being conditioned to recognize a classic Gosho misdirection would be Yuusaku being mentioned out of nowhere and all the seeds being planted that he would soon make an appearance. These tell-tale signs made many people instantly conclude Yuusaku was disguised as Okiya without anyone's posts to aid them. Of course, it's possible it's all a red herring, but everyone is used to this pattern and concluded this on their own for a reason.

I'm certainly one of those who have gotten used to that too... And that Gundam thing also reminds me of how many times I've seen people talk about how they hate the Gundam references without actually seeing the show, since this is the age of people who can't simply watch anything ancient or even anything new if they can't torrent it in hd hq 1080p. I wonder how long it will take for the next Gomera reference to surface after the 2014 movie comes out...

[PhantomWriter]

@thatlee:
Gosho promised us that we would know Amuro real name and the reason why Elena appear in flashback,so I guess that will happen after his confrontation with the real Akai.

I think Amuro will realize he's not talking to the right person,so he'll back off a little bit.He could act as if Conan's plan worked well,but prepare something to catch the real Akai.
Hopefully Amuro will use Sera as a bait and be more violent than he is now.Amuro knows Agasa is involved with Akai,so maybe he'll do something to Agasa and Ai(I hope so,in order to have a discussion concerning Elena).Using civilian people as a bait to catch Akai is more efficent than using his FBI friends,IMO.(since they have experience,they can escape,use guns...)
For now I don't feel any danger,even for the FBI.I have the feeling Amuro is just bluffing...anyway we'll have to wait and see...

Though I agree he'll back off when he realizes he's not talking to the right person and try to make it look like he thinks his deduction is wrong instead of being tricked, I don't quite think he is going to necessarily be more violent. If he uses bait, it would be a bad idea to rough them up at all too badly, especially considering Akai's overall demeanor.

[Sani]

I'm wondering... you guys seem to have it all figured out, but I'm still at a loss as to what Amuro actually planned to do when he rang the doorbell. It doesn't make any sense to me.

Wouldn't it have been better to first get his hands on Jodie and Camel before visiting Okiya? If that's what he wants to use to pressure Akai into revealing himself as Okiya, it's risky when he doesn't have total control over it by the time of the confrontation.
And wouldn't it have been better to wait for a moment where there are no reporters outside of the mansion? He had to walk right through them to get to the door. If he really didn't know they were there, then wouldn't that mean that he failed to even so much as observe the house? This seems really reckless, especially since he practically told Conan that he was a bad guy and openly questioned people about Kusuda's death. He must realize that Team Conan knows what he's up to and may soon arrive at Okiya's doorstep, so it makes even less sense to not take any precautions at all.
If he wanted to kill Akai so much and was convinced that Akai is Okiya, then this is the worst setting he could have used. He can't kill him in the house because the reporters are right outside and his picture would be all over the world the very next day. Kidnapping him to finish him off somewhere else is risky as hell since he can't just point a gun at Okiya with all of them standing out there, cameras at the ready. So he could make him follow 'voluntarily', but as he was assuming to be dealing with Akai, this would have created a lot of time for his target to think of ways to weasle out of his grasp and get away.

(I got confused with the tenses here. This was all meant to be from Amuro's pov before he gets to know that the Okiya he'll be talking to is not Akai, meaning what he had been planning, not what will eventually happen.)

So far, this seems to me as if it's as badly planned as the Bell Tree Express, with the difference that Team Conan had the excuse of being short on time. I hope he's got something else up his sleeve, but I certainly can't think of anything that would ensure his victory over Akai.
Did I miss anything telling that would hint to such a trump being up his sleeve? Or would he really just kill off Akai without caring that he'd be taken into custody right thereafter, just because he despises him so much?

And why did Amuro say that depending on Okiya's answers and actions, all of the 'friends' (reporters) might intrude on his hospitality? Can you think of answers/actions which would create this scenario?

[Xenita00]

Hi guys, days ago the japanese magazine Da Vinci did an interview to Gosho Aoyama and he revealed important information. I have a website with this interview in spanish, but you can read this interview in japanese in the web Da Vinci. If you want to see this interview in spanish this is the website:
http://tanteikid.blogspot.com.es/2014/0 ... rsary.html
I don't have japanese interview's web, sorry.

Spoiler:

Near the end Aoyama says:
The manga is starting to reveal more than the identity of "that person". First, it will be confirmed Tooru Amuro's real name. For some reason in his memories appears Haibara's mother, Elena . In addition to 2 moms are actually sisters ... Many things are connected. Too bad, I think I spoke too. Well, wait anxiously manga.

OMG Two moms are sisters, anyone know anything about this?

[MoonRaven]

I finally got my account to work. Yesh!
I don't have any specific theory since all the ideas that popped to my mind have already been mentioned here. But completely useless this post won't be. No-ho!

I shall share with you my very weird dream about that I had on the Fri-Sat night i.e. right after the spoilers of the file 895. I also mentioned the main points in Cbox but now you get the detailed version of it. Plesa note that this was before getting the translation to the file:

-Okiya(the real?) is with Amuro at the Kudou house. They continue talking about the Raiha pass incident.
-Somewhere in Tokyo a car is stopped by the police. Takagi asks the driver, Okiya(fake?), to open the trunk loike he had asked the previous stopped cars. In the trunk is a woman, Kir, who Okiya explains is being transported to safety. Takagi lets him continue.
-Amuro receives a call from his 'friend' who has followed that car. He becomes convinced that the Okiya with him is a 'real one' and the Okiya driving a fake i.e. Akai. He leaves the house with a vague apology for interrupting the Macademy Awards watching.
-In Raiha Pass Jodie and Camel arrive to the blockade made by cars. It's revealed that it's Conan, Yukiko and a third person(possibly Heiji) there. The trio picks up the agenst and they escape the cars following the two.
-The 'fake' Okiya joins them with Kir later. It's revealed that the fake was indeed Akai and the one at Kudou house it Yusaku.
-Amuro's goons are shaken off and trollsaku continues watching the Ma. The rest are hatching a plan.

I'd like to point out that it's onlky a dream that I just explained so I don't want any commetn how unlikely some things are or how this would never happen. Thank you.

[k11chi]

I'm wondering... you guys seem to have it all figured out, but I'm still at a loss as to what Amuro actually planned to do when he rang the doorbell. It doesn't make any sense to me.

Wouldn't it have been better to first get his hands on Jodie and Camel before visiting Okiya? If that's what he wants to use to pressure Akai into revealing himself as Okiya, it's risky when he doesn't have total control over it by the time of the confrontation.
And wouldn't it have been better to wait for a moment where there are no reporters outside of the mansion? He had to walk right through them to get to the door. If he really didn't know they were there, then wouldn't that mean that he failed to even so much as observe the house? This seems really reckless, especially since he practically told Conan that he was a bad guy and openly questioned people about Kusuda's death. He must realize that Team Conan knows what he's up to and may soon arrive at Okiya's doorstep, so it makes even less sense to not take any precautions at all.
If he wanted to kill Akai so much and was convinced that Akai is Okiya, then this is the worst setting he could have used. He can't kill him in the house because the reporters are right outside and his picture would be all over the world the very next day. Kidnapping him to finish him off somewhere else is risky as hell since he can't just point a gun at Okiya with all of them standing out there, cameras at the ready. So he could make him follow 'voluntarily', but as he was assuming to be dealing with Akai, this would have created a lot of time for his target to think of ways to weasle out of his grasp and get away.

(I got confused with the tenses here. This was all meant to be from Amuro's pov before he gets to know that the Okiya he'll be talking to is not Akai, meaning what he had been planning, not what will eventually happen.)

So far, this seems to me as if it's as badly planned as the Bell Tree Express, with the difference that Team Conan had the excuse of being short on time. I hope he's got something else up his sleeve, but I certainly can't think of anything that would ensure his victory over Akai.
Did I miss anything telling that would hint to such a trump being up his sleeve? Or would he really just kill off Akai without caring that he'd be taken into custody right thereafter, just because he despises him so much?

And why did Amuro say that depending on Okiya's answers and actions, all of the 'friends' (reporters) might intrude on his hospitality? Can you think of answers/actions which would create this scenario?

I like how you assume Amuro would have a plan that would guarantee his victory over multiple people that are smarter than him. Also that's called bluffing, the answers are irrelevant and he's there just to confirm something right now, they're sipping tea...

[AICHAN]

@thatlee:
Gosho promised us that we would know Amuro real name and the reason why Elena appear in flashback,so I guess that will happen after his confrontation with the real Akai.

I think Amuro will realize he's not talking to the right person,so he'll back off a little bit.He could act as if Conan's plan worked well,but prepare something to catch the real Akai.
Hopefully Amuro will use Sera as a bait and be more violent than he is now.Amuro knows Agasa is involved with Akai,so maybe he'll do something to Agasa and Ai(I hope so,in order to have a discussion concerning Elena).Using civilian people as a bait to catch Akai is more efficent than using his FBI friends,IMO.(since they have experience,they can escape,use guns...)
For now I don't feel any danger,even for the FBI.I have the feeling Amuro is just bluffing...anyway we'll have to wait and see...

Though I agree he'll back off when he realizes he's not talking to the right person and try to make it look like he thinks his deduction is wrong instead of being tricked, I don't quite think he is going to necessarily be more violent. If he uses bait, it would be a bad idea to rough them up at all too badly, especially considering Akai's overall demeanor.

I personally don't see Amuro as a violent person(for me he's a good guy doing wrong things for his own good reason).But I would like him to be more menacing himself,(without using his companion),instead of talking,so that Akai would be more reactive.a bit like during the MT case when he hold his gun.At least that would be a real confrontation,to have both Amuro and Akai showing their wild side.

@Xenita00:there is the whole translation of that interview in the DCW forum.For the two mom being sister I guess it's Yukiko and Kid's mom.

[ThatLee4]

@AICHAN Ithink the two mums being sisters might be Bourbon's mum and either Ai's mum or Akia's mum. Or Akia's mum and Ai's mum, hence her mum in Amouro's flash back.

[MeiTanteixX]

And why did Amuro say that depending on Okiya's answers and actions, all of the 'friends' (reporters) might intrude on his hospitality? Can you think of answers/actions which would create this scenario?

it could be that he assumed that the reporters were actually BO members that were following his movements, after maybe being notified by vermouth that he is up to something, and thus waiting to make a move depending on if amuro does something irrational because of his personal feelings for Akai. Vermouth seems awfully convinced about akai being dead after all....

Remember that this is just possible reason for why he said that, and not a theory that I've devoted myself to.

[PhantomWriter]

@AICHAN Ithink the two mums being sisters might be Bourbon's mum and either Ai's mum or Akia's mum. Or Akia's mum and Ai's mum, hence her mum in Amouro's flash back.

...Well, if the latter happens, that makes Akai's infiltration in the Org. using Akemi and the shipping I keep seeing of Haibara and Subaru so incredibly awkward. (First cousin incest.)

As for the discussion of Amuro bluffing, I'm pretty sure he is bluffing about what's going to happen to Jodie and Camel and the reporters outside. His tell seems to be hiding his hands, from what I can see.

[AICHAN]

@AICHAN Ithink the two mums being sisters might be Bourbon's mum and either Ai's mum or Akia's mum. Or Akia's mum and Ai's mum, hence her mum in Amouro's flash back.

...Well, if the latter happens, that makes Akai's infiltration in the Org. using Akemi and the shipping I keep seeing of Haibara and Subaru so incredibly awkward. (First cousin incest.)

As for the discussion of Amuro bluffing, I'm pretty sure he is bluffing about what's going to happen to Jodie and Camel and the reporters outside. His tell seems to be hiding his hands, from what I can see.

Spoiler:

yeah that's right,I don't see that happening(and I'm glad I'm not the only Subasu/shiho fan^^),so I'm still thinking about Conan's mum and Kid's mom,mostly because Gosho said once that they look alike for a reason.
and concerning Amuro I agree with you about him bluffing...but who knows what he's planning.