Rum Arc Discussion Thread (Plot + Characters)

[Zerozaki4869]

Rum is one among Kuroda, Wakita and Rumi. Which is confirmed by Gosho.

[Reader]

I don't think Wakita can be yusaku. But I do think that wakita is in team conan. I am saying this based on Conan's lack of suspicion towards him in the series kinda like the okiya - conan thing in Bourbon arc.

[vaibhavgupte]

Rum is one among Kuroda, Wakita and Rumi. Which is confirmed by Gosho.

I just count how many times you say this lol.
If this is confined by story to three suspects like bourbon arc, I will give on muga iori is rum theory, but
till then I stick to the fact that gosho is lying.
gosho hinted that he could be cheating like agasa.
and this is not random case its start of rum arc and
just before first mention of rum.

[Reader]

As for the third photo: There is a person who appeared in a very large panel in chapter 1005 if I remember well , but we did not see his face for some reason and this person was following the news that says Kudo Shinchi is alive , I mean this is Goshu's habit when he really wants Hiding a person’s identity from us but he refers to it in a difficult way to notice , so this is my intention when saying there is a fourth hidden suspect .

I never took this cheating by agasa and the fourth suspect thing seriously. But also I missed this detail in a panel from 1005. Only the palm holding the smartphone is shown. Even though wakita and Kuroda are shown holding their phone in the succeeding panels, the way they are holding it is different. The large panel has clearly a different person.
Now why would gosho do that? Because the three rum suspects are shown anyway on the next page. This makes me think that there is a fourth hidden suspect. Why else would he give a large panel to an unkown hand?

But if that is the case, why lie to us about there being only three suspects?

Tricky.

[vaibhavgupte]

As for the third photo: There is a person who appeared in a very large panel in chapter 1005 if I remember well , but we did not see his face for some reason and this person was following the news that says Kudo Shinchi is alive , I mean this is Goshu's habit when he really wants Hiding a person’s identity from us but he refers to it in a difficult way to notice , so this is my intention when saying there is a fourth hidden suspect .

I never took this cheating by agasa and the fourth suspect thing seriously. But also I missed this detail in a panel from 1005. Only the palm holding the smartphone is shown. Even though wakita and Kuroda are shown holding their phone in the succeeding panels, the way they are holding it is different. The large panel has clearly a different person.
Now why would gosho do that? Because the three rum suspects are shown anyway on the next page. This makes me think that there is a fourth hidden suspect. Why else would he give a large panel to an unkown hand?

But if that is the case, why lie to us about there being only three suspects?

Tricky.

if iori muga is rum its obvious that gosho didnt include
him among three suspects. it would be too obvious
that he was introduced on friday the thirteenth or butsumetsu.

bdw iori's phone is shown in chp 1041 .you can check.
its black.

[Zerozaki4869]

This Image is constantly used to insinuate that Iori is Rum and consistently Rumi is used as the example.

This is a common manga trope, called scary eye glasses trope, it is to emphasize that the character in question has an aura of commanding authority around him/her.

Another example


This image is consistently used to insinuate that Iori has a different hair colour(lighter) as his eyeborws have a different design.

This guy is full blown Japanese yet has the same design.

So does this family.
This is a genetic trait which can be found in Japanese people due to some mutation, it doesn't imply a foreign genetic connection.


This picture of Iori is often used to insinuate that his supposed lighter hair made him look old during his organization days.

Unlike the above picture this is not a speculator's imagination rather in-manga established fact. Gin has white hair, yet hardly gets called an old man.
Having a light coloured hair doesn't make one old. Hair colour needs to get associated with something else, like ageing face (Kuroda), walking with a cane (Kansuke). Plus Jodie, Vermouth are full blown foreigners, they have light coloured hair, they don'y come off as old.


This photo is often used to say how good Iori is in concealing his presence. But if one looks closely, Iori is sitting just beside the pillar, hiding him from the sight of any customer entering the place and directly going towards the central part for a seat. Nothing big is happening here.

This picture is often used to say that "Look Iori was going to flee.", but that is a total misappropriation of facts. The culprit came out of the bathroom, stabbed the victim, the victim cried out, the culprit pulled off the knife, made a run to the bathroom. It is necessary for the black out to be around 40-45 seconds at minimum. If one counts the time from when Iori heard the noise and when the lights came back, there was sufficient time to sneak out, given Iori is just sitting so close to the entrance/exit. On the other hand it proves Iori was going to risk his life to apprehend an armed culprit, so he has a strong sense of Justice and confidence in his physical prowess.


This is Haibara's statement about Rum's physical appearances. Look the words here are strong giant, feminine man and old man.
The point here that Rum is not just a strong man or a big man, he is a strong giant/strongly built big man. Rum's strong giant physical appearance has come to Conan's mind only thrice, (once Kansuke cause he did describe Kansuke as a strongly built in his monologue).

The person on the right reminded Conan of Rum's strong giant description.

Kuroda : The "Stocky" Rum suspect.

Iori is just a bit taller than Takagi and has a similar slender build. At max you can call him tall, athletic handsome, not a strong giant.


Some users use Iori's time keeping habit to make him impatient but they do earnestly forget that Momiji herself values her time like "A moment of time is costlier than ten thousand pieces of gold." so it is very much drilled into poor Iori by Momiji's antics. So instead of blaming the employee take the employer head on.

So Iori is not Rum. QED

Gosho doesn't lie, so Rum is one of the three......

[vaibhavgupte]

This Image is constantly used to insinuate that Iori is Rum and consistently Rumi is used as the example.

This is a common manga trope, called scary eye glasses trope, it is to emphasize that the character in question has an aura of commanding authority around him/her.

Another example


This image is consistently used to insinuate that Iori has a different hair colour(lighter) as his eyeborws have a different design.

This guy is full blown Japanese yet has the same design.

So does this family.
This is a genetic trait which can be found in Japanese people due to some mutation, it doesn't imply a foreign genetic connection.


This picture of Iori is often used to insinuate that his supposed lighter hair made him look old during his organization days.

Unlike the above picture this is not a speculator's imagination rather in-manga established fact. Gin has white hair, yet hardly gets called an old man.
Having a light coloured hair doesn't make one old. Hair colour needs to get associated with something else, like ageing face (Kuroda), walking with a cane (Kansuke). Plus Jodie, Vermouth are full blown foreigners, they have light coloured hair, they don'y come off as old.


This photo is often used to say how good Iori is in concealing his presence. But if one looks closely, Iori is sitting just beside the pillar, hiding him from the sight of any customer entering the place and directly going towards the central part for a seat. Nothing big is happening here.

This picture is often used to say that "Look Iori was going to flee.", but that is a total misappropriation of facts. The culprit came out of the bathroom, stabbed the victim, the victim cried out, the culprit pulled off the knife, made a run to the bathroom. It is necessary for the black out to be around 40-45 seconds at minimum. If one counts the time from when Iori heard the noise and when the lights came back, there was sufficient time to sneak out, given Iori is just sitting so close to the entrance/exit. On the other hand it proves Iori was going to risk his life to apprehend an armed culprit, so he has a strong sense of Justice and confidence in his physical prowess.


This is Haibara's statement about Rum's physical appearances. Look the words here are strong giant, feminine man and old man.
The point here that Rum is not just a strong man or a big man, he is a strong giant/strongly built big man. Rum's strong giant physical appearance has come to Conan's mind only thrice, (once Kansuke cause he did describe Kansuke as a strongly built in his monologue).

The person on the right reminded Conan of Rum's strong giant description.

Kuroda : The "Stocky" Rum suspect.

Iori is just a bit taller than Takagi and has a similar slender build. At max you can call him tall, athletic handsome, not a strong giant.


Some users use Iori's time keeping habit to make him impatient but they do earnestly forget that Momiji herself values her time like "A moment of time is costlier than ten thousand pieces of gold." so it is very much drilled into poor Iori by Momiji's antics. So instead of blaming the employee take the employer head on.

So Iori is not Rum. QED

Gosho doesn't lie, so Rum is one of the three......

forget about foreshadowings and appearances .
they arent always solid and one can keep on arguing on them. lets talk on evidence aspect.
1) the timing of rum's message to bourbon tells a lot.
it didnt came when shinichi is alive rumours were going on.
(it was like shinichi being alive was expected to the rum, as if he was present there in kyoto).
this was the time when wakita was investigating shinichi.
probably from gin's orders .
gin was worried as its his mistake. (although gin
doesnt remember vodka does remember shinichi).
but wakita and thus gin and vodka became releived once heiji conveyed the news that it wasnt shinichi but okita.
But unlike them rum is now interested in shinichi as if
"he knows shinichi isnt okita and heiji lied on tv" .
iori is the one who knows this anfd not 3 rum suspects.
none of them know okita. so its hard to believe they would
get triggered by shinichi is okita.


2) Its very hard to believe that such viral message
mentioning shinichi rumoured to be dead message wasnt
read by iori.
and if read he should have asked ran about it.
as a buttler who wants to ensure security of ooka
he should have kept track of news and specially of
the fact that a guy shinichi who met ooka was supposed
to be dead. and the explanation given on tv by heiji
was shinichi is okita. iori obviuosly knows its wrong.
so why didnt he mention anything about it in the next
meeting in lover code case.
instead he thinks shinichi is alive despite death rumours.

these two points are very interesting.

[Zerozaki4869]

"he knows shinichi isnt okita and heiji lied on tv" .

If Iori was Rum he already knew that Shinichi who is supposedly dead is seen alive and is not Okita. So Rum won't wait till the news starts spreading he will tell Bourbon to act instantly.

iori obviuosly knows its wrong.
so why didnt he mention anything about it in the next
meeting in lover code case.
instead he thinks shinichi is alive despite death rumours.

Rather a proof that he is unrelated to plot and believes in Conan's bullshit.

forget about foreshadowings and appearances .
they arent always solid and one can keep on arguing on them

Rum has a prosthetic eye.....so unless Iori has one he doesn't qualify.
Rum has a giant body......Iori don't have one.
Rum has an old man trait......Iori has none.
So you see appearance means a lot for Rum......Iori don't even qualify for a suspect, much like Chikara.
Chikara can still be not Rum and Kohji's killer but Iori......(dead horse)

[vaibhavgupte]

"he knows shinichi isnt okita and heiji lied on tv" .

If Iori was Rum he already knew that Shinichi who is supposedly dead is seen alive and is not Okita. So Rum won't wait till the news starts spreading he will tell Bourbon to act instantly.

iori obviuosly knows its wrong.
so why didnt he mention anything about it in the next
meeting in lover code case.
instead he thinks shinichi is alive despite death rumours.

Rather a proof that he is unrelated to plot and believes in Conan's bullshit.

forget about foreshadowings and appearances .
they arent always solid and one can keep on arguing on them

Rum has a prosthetic eye.....so unless Iori has one he doesn't qualify.
Rum has a giant body......Iori don't have one.
Rum has an old man trait......Iori has none.
So you see appearance means a lot for Rum......Iori don't even qualify for a suspect, much like Chikara.
Chikara can still be not Rum and Kohji's killer but Iori......(dead horse)

iori is definitely strong and regarding giant thing he is
exceptionally tall
and to medium sized thin man he can look giant.
its based on who sees you.

old man if his hair colour is gray he can look definitely.

and the most important is eye thing.
haibara said rum's one eye is artificial (prosthetic)
now why a prosthetic eye is used even if there
isnt vision in it ?
answer is that to look normal. it looks"almost"
like normal eye.
so anyone who is covering eye is out of prosthetic suspect.
since if artifcial eye is just to look good why cover it
whats the purpose of fitting a prosthetic eye then
if you are hiding it.
if you want to anyway hide eyes there just put bandage
or dark goggle on the gone eye directly instead fitting prosthetic.
so those covering eyes like kuroda and kanenori are out.

And remember its prosthetic not gone eye.
in kuroda's case we can see through his glass in some
panel I will search if you want.
we can clearly see his eye is gone. there arent any eyeballs

prosthetic eye looks very similar to normal ,
this makes iori a candidate and rules out kuroda
and kanenori.

[Reader]

Saying ' Iori is unrelated to plot ' is bit too strong I guess. One can't make such an assertion as of yet. Remember Dr. Araide.

[Zerozaki4869]

regarding giant thing he is
exceptionally tall

Just one more inch to Takagi.....(Takagi is a giant, I see. never knew.)

why a prosthetic eye is used even if there
isnt vision in it ?

Iori's eyes are normal and his vision is perfect. (So there is no proof)

kuroda's case we can see through his glass in some
pane

That has a definite shape of a fake eye. As Yui suggested during his intro.

old man if his hair colour is gray he can look definitely.

Nobody called Gin an old man...plus there is no proof Iori's hair is white/gray. Given his eyeborws are a common trait.

So it's just speculation.......

[Mohamed Ebrahem]

Well , Zero
Your opinion about Goshu's statement that Rum is one of the three is the same opinion of most of fans , but let me explain some important points :

Gin said that the Koji murder case contains mistakes by RUM .
But we were surprised that there was a mirror message referring to "Karasuma" , doesn't this mean that Karasuma who is involved in that case ? and he mistake when he left a message referring to his name , but I'm sure this death message made by Wakasa Rumi .

But it is not the only misfortune that befell Karasuma , because Haneda Koji left a message referring to "Chikara Katsumata" , which is the current identity of Karasuma , this identity which Karasuma appears as in front of people , but people do not know that he is the same Karasuma .

So this means that Chikara Katsumata = Karasuma Renya .

Karasuma could be the boss of the organization at time of Kohji's death so he didn't have a code name as other members , but the organization may have appointed a new boss other than Karasuma as his cover may also be discovered at any moment due to this mistakes in the Koji case, so the organization appointed another boss better than Karasuma and Karasuma be number 2 and was given the code name "RUM" .

And surely you know that it makes no sense to know the current boss of the organization now while we are still in Arc RUM , Goshu's jump is strange but it would make sense if Karasuma becomes RUM . as many characters talk about Karasuma in this Arc like Yusaku, Conan, Wakasa Rumi and Akai .

As for Goshu's statement that Rum is one of the three suspects ,
Goshu said " it's indeed" , but this is not the whole statement , the statement is " it's indeed" , and also a picture has four people , three are clear (Gin ,Vodka ,Vermoth ) and a hidden fourth .
Why not assuming, even if a small percentage , that Goshu meant there was a fourth suspect hidden when he posted that photo with this statement ? If you focus only on the statement Zero , and forget that there is a picture attached to it , this reminds me of Mori Koguru when he refers to someone as a murderer without searching and verifying the whole truth .

Also zero , If we were going to rely on Gosho's statements on such matters , then why do we follow Anime Conan ? It is possible for us to content ourselves with the statements and conferences of Goshu so we know from him the most important details and secrets in anime without following the anime ourselves and don't think about its mysteries .

Even if that picture does not exist with the statement , the possibility that Goshu deceived us by saying that Rum is one of the three is possible , because in the manga itself he sometimes cheats , for example :
1 - Okiya Subaru's age . 2 - Vermouth age . 3- After Akai's death , Goshu shout at manga that one of the silver bullet had gone "Akai" and another remained "Conan" , but in the end it turned out that Akai was alive .

So changing such facts , although this is not a good thing , but this is Goshu's style and we should accept it .

[vaibhavgupte]

Well , Zero
Your opinion about Goshu's statement that Rum is one of the three is the same opinion of most of fans , but let me explain some important points :

Gin said that the Koji murder case contains mistakes by RUM .
But we were surprised that there was a mirror message referring to "Karasuma" , doesn't this mean that Karasuma who is involved in that case ? and he mistake when he left a message referring to his name , but I'm sure this death message made by Wakasa Rumi .

But it is not the only misfortune that befell Karasuma , because Haneda Koji left a message referring to "Chikara Katsumata" , which is the current identity of Karasuma , this identity which Karasuma appears as in front of people , but people do not know that he is the same Karasuma .

So this means that Chikara Katsumata = Karasuma Renya .

Karasuma could be the boss of the organization at time of Kohji's death so he didn't have a code name as other members , but the organization may have appointed a new boss other than Karasuma as his cover may also be discovered at any moment due to this mistakes in the Koji case, so the organization appointed another boss better than Karasuma and Karasuma be number 2 and was given the code name "RUM" .

And surely you know that it makes no sense to know the current boss of the organization now while we are still in Arc RUM , Goshu's jump is strange but it would make sense if Karasuma becomes RUM . as many characters talk about Karasuma in this Arc like Yusaku, Conan, Wakasa Rumi and Akai .

As for Goshu's statement that Rum is one of the three suspects ,
Goshu said " it's indeed" , but this is not the whole statement , the statement is " it's indeed" , and also a picture has four people , three are clear (Gin ,Vodka ,Vermoth ) and a hidden fourth .
Why not assuming, even if a small percentage , that Goshu meant there was a fourth suspect hidden when he posted that photo with this statement ? If you focus only on the statement Zero , and forget that there is a picture attached to it , this reminds me of Mori Koguru when he refers to someone as a murderer without searching and verifying the whole truth .

Also zero , If we were going to rely on Gosho's statements on such matters , then why do we follow Anime Conan ? It is possible for us to content ourselves with the statements and conferences of Goshu so we know from him the most important details and secrets in anime without following the anime ourselves and don't think about its mysteries .

Even if that picture does not exist with the statement , the possibility that Goshu deceived us by saying that Rum is one of the three is possible , because in the manga itself he sometimes cheats , for example :
1 - Okiya Subaru's age . 2 - Vermouth age . 3- After Akai's death , Goshu shout at manga that one of the silver bullet had gone "Akai" and another remained "Conan" , but in the end it turned out that Akai was alive .

So changing such facts , although this is not a good thing , but this is Goshu's style and we should accept it .

karasuma being the form of message doesnt necesarily mean karasuma renya , rum coud be part of karasuma
family . MeiTanteixX in this forum already pointed that shogi piece
is uma which is dragon horse. and in chess a horse or
knight could be in G place of chess board so this full message could be muga karasuma.
this is just example to show that it need not be renya
karasuma since nowhere from dying message renya
is inferred .
it could also refer to karasuma group. we dont know.

There is no point in changing boss as this whole bo
works for some boss's personal benefit or motive.
so there is no point in changing the boss.

regarding katsumata yup I really believe he has a good chance to be karasuma renya , the de aged boss himself
his nose is similar to karasuma figure nose.
but Icant be sure without much proof.

but in no way I beleive karasuma is rum coz karasuma
works for himself he killed people as a motvation to
find gold in his house.
even if he makes mistake , he is richest and has power
plus he doent die. there is no way he would become
second in command. hewouldrather die than becoming
second in command. he is too greedy.

regarding power muga iori has power to summon the governor of tokyo for no reason. katsumata has no
power directly although he is famous.
he coud be boss who tells a powerful loyal rum
eg iori who can manipulate ooka to do anything for bo
unknowingly.

since you know gin and vodka dont seem to have some
postion of power in soceity neither does vermouth
she is actress not minister.
so someone must have powerful position in japan
inside bo.

and if you say hyogo kaneshiro , okinawa governor is bo boss. first of all he is not even governor he is just mayor
according to translation I read.
evenif he is okinawa governor,
iori has more power than him who could summon
tokyo governor for no reason. since tokyo governor
is much more powerful than ikinawa governor.

the only three things to prove hyogo is boss are:
1) his phone number
2) dragon palace clue
3) he looks like vemouth husband from behind.

these clues are not suficient.
gosho already said in interview that vermouth husband looks is irrelevant.
goshodoesnt lie always. in rum's case he left clue and lied.

boss phone number somehow becomes kuro hyogo kaneshiro.
is not hyogo kaneshiro only. sowe cant be sure.
japanese kanji and pronounciation canhave multiple meanings so its very dubious.
and this kuro ( black) at the start makes it more of a
dubious interprtation since conan calls it bo but
haibara from starting infers it has a different name.
so black isnt important to org except that it has
black clothes that too coz of crow which is karasuma's
symbol.

[vaibhavgupte]

regarding giant thing he is
exceptionally tall

Just one more inch to Takagi.....(Takagi is a giant, I see. never knew.)

why a prosthetic eye is used even if there
isnt vision in it ?

Iori's eyes are normal and his vision is perfect. (So there is no proof)

kuroda's case we can see through his glass in some
pane

That has a definite shape of a fake eye. As Yui suggested during his intro.

old man if his hair colour is gray he can look definitely.

Nobody called Gin an old man...plus there is no proof Iori's hair is white/gray. Given his eyeborws are a common trait.

So it's just speculation.......

In chapter 987 panel 13 where kuroda takes wakasa rumi's
name we can clearly see that his eye his blank
he has no eyeballs. not even fake.
so how are you claiming he has prosthetic

[Zerozaki4869]

https://s5.mkklcdnv5.com/mangakakalot/r ... tion/7.jpg
Yui tells directly. Eyeball less eyes are shut like kansuke's. (So your idea makes 0 sense.)

https://m66qs02g8tfhc.3dzsqg1ydq73m.man ... 6f/x17.png

Haibara tells Conan that Rum has injured and lost his eye in some accident. And one of his eyes seems to be prosthetic.
So Rum had an accident which blinded him in one eye, which is assumed to be a prosthetic is the correct description.....(that's how Yui describes Kuroda's eye.)