Will it always be like that?

[Kor]

Conan-tachi has allowed two culprits to go free even before Haibara was introduced. Once, for a kidnapping (Blackmailed Soccer Player), once for attempted murder (Scuba Murder). He's wasn't a justice-must-be-served hard ass in the first place. Contrast that with Sato in Love Story 7 (and remember Sato took a shot as a defenseless culprit herself before that (12,000,000 Hostages))...

You're overlooking something here. One good deed can't clear 100 bad deeds. The bad deeds will always be remembered. Such with Conan. if a person does more "bad" deeds than "good" deeds, we will think of that person as a "bad" person.
Bottom line, just because Conan let go of the culprit acouple of times, doesn't change the fact that in the hundreds of the other times he was a "justice must be served" person.

[milaneechan]

I think plenty of the murders are not justified at all, and I barely ever feel sorry for the murderer.

Since you said you have already watched past 78, I feel ok to talk about the Holmes freak murder case. Those murders were completely unjustified, and that guy was insane. That had to be the dumbest reason for a murder I have ever heard.

I think there has only been one time when I really felt sorry for the murderer, but that's later in the series, so I won't talk about it.

[Nyarl]

Conan-tachi has allowed two culprits to go free even before Haibara was introduced. Once, for a kidnapping (Blackmailed Soccer Player), once for attempted murder (Scuba Murder). He's wasn't a justice-must-be-served hard ass in the first place. Contrast that with Sato in Love Story 7 (and remember Sato took a shot as a defenseless culprit herself before that (12,000,000 Hostages))...

You're overlooking something here. One good deed can't clear 100 bad deeds. The bad deeds will always be remembered. Such with Conan. if a person does more "bad" deeds than "good" deeds, we will think of that person as a "bad" person.
Bottom line, just because Conan let go of the culprit acouple of times, doesn't change the fact that in the hundreds of the other times he was a "justice must be served" person.

You can still think his code of justice is leading him to make morally "wrong" choices too often  ::) , but you can't claim it's absolutist and without nuance or applied without hint of favoritism. Well, I suppose you can just ignore exceptions and cling to biased generalizations, too, but that'd make you wrong, absolutely.

[Kor]

You can still think his code of justice is leading him to make morally "wrong" choices too often  , but you can't claim it's absolutist and without nuance (which people have been claiming). Well, I suppose you can just ignore exceptions and cling to biased generalizations, too, but that'd make you wrong, absolutely.

I never said it's absolute and I don't ignore the exceptions.
But you have to understand that it's not "biased generalization", it's called "opinion"
Also, what builds the character in our eyes (aside from the character's personality) are the character's actions.
let's have a character and call him X. X is a warrior who fights in battles. Almost all the times, X kills his opponents after defeating them, even though in part of the times, his enemies beg for their lives. Then rarely, we X actually feels sorry for his opponent and let him live.
If in most of the times, X killed his enemies (though he could have let them live after defeating them), yet there are some rare occasions in which X spares the life of his enemies, how are we supposed to look at this character? This is where our opinion comes into the picture.

[meidei]

Well, going back to Shin'ichi, we have to admit that he wouldn't left a criminal die just because he is a criminal. Neither would Kogoro or Heiji. And yes, this is actually unrelated to the fact that they don't (try to/are unable to) understand the motives of the criminal but it adds to their general profile.
Gosho Aoyama is trying to balance his characters most of the time.

[Nyarl]

You can still think his code of justice is leading him to make morally "wrong" choices too often  , but you can't claim it's absolutist and without nuance (which people have been claiming). Well, I suppose you can just ignore exceptions and cling to biased generalizations, too, but that'd make you wrong, absolutely.

I never said it's absolute and I don't ignore the exceptions.
But you have to understand that it's not "biased generalization", it's called "opinion"

::sigh:: You may not have, but the people I was responding to certainly were calling Conan's code of justice black and white (and it might be for a successful murderer, but it's absolutely not for anything short of that, that's what the exceptions prove... unless you want to argue that the exceptions don't mean anything because Aoyama doesn't care about characterization). "I hate when Conan turns murderers like X over to the police," is opinion that can't be right or wrong, an aesthetic judgment like liking the color green."Conan is a bad shallow one dimensional character because he has an absolutist no-crime-shall-go-unpunished sense of justice," on the other hand would just be wrong, even if it were just an opinion.

[soratothamax]

I think plenty of the murders are not justified at all, and I barely ever feel sorry for the murderer.

Since you said you have already watched past 78, I feel ok to talk about the Holmes freak murder case. Those murders were completely unjustified, and that guy was insane. That had to be the dumbest reason for a murder I have ever heard.

I think there has only been one time when I really felt sorry for the murderer, but that's later in the series, so I won't talk about it.

you've got such a point. Because when I look back and think about those murders, I'm like "All the dude did was step on your foot/pushed you/yelled at you/and fired you?" I mean seriously, look for another job. Get over it. The victims were a**holes yea, but none of the victims actually killed the perps....and almost none of the murders were self-defense....

[soratothamax]

You can still think his code of justice is leading him to make morally "wrong" choices too often  , but you can't claim it's absolutist and without nuance (which people have been claiming). Well, I suppose you can just ignore exceptions and cling to biased generalizations, too, but that'd make you wrong, absolutely.

I never said it's absolute and I don't ignore the exceptions.
But you have to understand that it's not "biased generalization", it's called "opinion"

::sigh:: You may not have, but the people I was responding to certainly were calling Conan's code of justice black and white (and it might be for a successful murderer, but it's absolutely not for anything short of that, that's what the exceptions prove... unless you want to argue that the exceptions don't mean anything because Aoyama doesn't care about characterization). "I hate when Conan turns murderers like X over to the police," is opinion that can't be right or wrong, an aesthetic judgment like liking the color green."Conan is a bad shallow one dimensional character because he has an absolutist no-crime-shall-go-unpunished sense of justice," on the other hand would just be wrong, even if it were just an opinion.

To some degree I agree with what you are saying here. I believe that to take a life, no matter how much the person who committed the crime, is unacceptable, as there are many other alternatives to solve problems besides murdering someone else's husband/brother/sister/cousin. There are so many different personalities, and so many people get offended by different things. Would we murder them everytime we feel offended? So I see why Shinichi is so stern with the people. He wants them to recognize and think about their crimes, know that it was wrong, and not to do it again so blood won't be shed on another person. We all do something to hurt someone, but we don't expect that person to come at us with a knife! So bloodshed isn't the answer no matter what....

However, Conan isn't very sympathetic to their circumstances. He isn't very consoling so that the criminals could ease their hearts and realize the crime was senseless. He said so himself, "He never will understand a murderer." I think if he ever wants to be a good detective he has to be firm, but sympathetic. He should at least talk about it with them first, instead of trying to bust them out in the open with a deduction show...

Now to me, I do think Conan is a shallow character...which is why I like the character...

[kkslider5552000]

I've read a few times that murderers get far less time in prison in Japan.

that might explain about Conan's mostly lack of sympathy for murderers

[Detective Prince]

Does anyone know the most ridculous reason anyone has ever killed someone over in DC?

[Abs.]

Does anyone know the most ridculous reason anyone has ever killed someone over in DC?

All of them.

[Detective Prince]

Does anyone know the most ridculous reason anyone has ever killed someone over in DC?

All of them.

Lmao

[randompi314159]

You can still think his code of justice is leading him to make morally "wrong" choices too often  , but you can't claim it's absolutist and without nuance (which people have been claiming). Well, I suppose you can just ignore exceptions and cling to biased generalizations, too, but that'd make you wrong, absolutely.

I never said it's absolute and I don't ignore the exceptions.
But you have to understand that it's not "biased generalization", it's called "opinion"

::sigh:: You may not have, but the people I was responding to certainly were calling Conan's code of justice black and white (and it might be for a successful murderer, but it's absolutely not for anything short of that, that's what the exceptions prove... unless you want to argue that the exceptions don't mean anything because Aoyama doesn't care about characterization). "I hate when Conan turns murderers like X over to the police," is opinion that can't be right or wrong, an aesthetic judgment like liking the color green."Conan is a bad shallow one dimensional character because he has an absolutist no-crime-shall-go-unpunished sense of justice," on the other hand would just be wrong, even if it were just an opinion.

To some degree I agree with what you are saying here. I believe that to take a life, no matter how much the person who committed the crime, is unacceptable, as there are many other alternatives to solve problems besides murdering someone else's husband/brother/sister/cousin. There are so many different personalities, and so many people get offended by different things. Would we murder them everytime we feel offended? So I see why Shinichi is so stern with the people. He wants them to recognize and think about their crimes, know that it was wrong, and not to do it again so blood won't be shed on another person. We all do something to hurt someone, but we don't expect that person to come at us with a knife! So bloodshed isn't the answer no matter what....

However, Conan isn't very sympathetic to their circumstances. He isn't very consoling so that the criminals could ease their hearts and realize the crime was senseless. He said so himself, "He never will understand a murderer." I think if he ever wants to be a good detective he has to be firm, but sympathetic. He should at least talk about it with them first, instead of trying to bust them out in the open with a deduction show...

Now to me, I do think Conan is a shallow character...which is why I like the character...

That's true. But when you mentioned the second part, my thoughts came to Kogoro...

[Nyarl]

Does anyone know the most ridculous reason anyone has ever killed someone over in DC?

In the revolving sushi case, the murder's motive was awfully close to, "He was mean to me on the internets!"

[Detective Prince]

Does anyone know the most ridculous reason anyone has ever killed someone over in DC?

In the revolving sushi case, the murder's motive was awfully close to, "He was mean to me on the internets!"

Hahaha we should make a thread of this.