Ai + Conan

[Schillok]

then there's no point. Ran - childhood friend who shares a part of Shinichi's past. Why would Gosho make another one have a part of his past? Haibara is the opposite from Ran. Haibara doesn't have any past with Shinichi and it fits very well if there is indeed a love triangle. in a romance the girls in the love triangle will NEVER be the same, for the fact they should be different. If one of the females has a past with the male, the other one shouldn't. Otherwise it's boring (btw, I'm not talking about Harem here)

Well, I agree here. Ai really is the opposite of Ran. Which is one of the reasons why I don't think AixConan would work, but everyone can have a different opinion about that.
As you said, just because they are different doesn't make it automatically a love triangle.

Haibara in episode 131 "I'm 18. just perfect for you." if Gosho didn't intend for ANYTHING to happen between the two, then he basically screwed up BIG TIME. writing such a line WILL make people think that she has something for Conan.

If I remember correctly it was another one of these joke scenes. Didn't she say before that she was 80 years old? Sure, we know that this is PROBABLY not her real age (you never know 100% sure, see Vermouth  ) and when she said it it was meant to confuse Conan, not to "hint her interest in him".
Or maybe it was a hint to show little Conan actually knows about her.

Another thing... I am pretty sure I read a different translation in which it was said she was 23 and something like "so not much different from you". I think I am not the only person, I heard that Shiho is over 20 from a few other people as well. But it should show that we need to be careful on how serious we take the translations we read.

Ayumi is a little girl who knows nothing about love. Fine, let's have a youth crush which means nothing. if Conan was going to consider something about Ayumi...I would hate him for sure.

The question is how much different is it for Haibara? Sure, she might have the mind of an adult, but her body is the same age as Ayumis. Conan never saw how Shiho looks like - save for maybe a moment from a distance of 20 Meter on a roof during a night with snowfall and while hidding outside the view of 2 man in black standing between him and Shiho.

Let's be honest, before Conan and Ai could "consider something" about anyone they should get their normal bodys back, either by an antidote or failing to get one and taking 10 years to grow up again. Either way would be the end of the Manga.

[James Rye]

The question is how much different is it for Haibara? Sure, she might have the mind of an adult, but her body is the same age as Ayumis. Conan never saw how Shiho looks like - save for maybe a moment from a distance of 20 Meter on a roof during a night with snowfall and while hidding outside the view of 2 man in black standing between him and Shiho.

Not much, having an adult mind and an adult body are two pair of shoes. Meaning he actually never really saw her, you forgot the glasses she wear that day.^g^

Let's be honest, before Conan and Ai could "consider something" about anyone they should get their normal bodys back, either by an antidote or failing to get one and taking 10 years to grow up again. Either way would be the end of the Manga.

Nah, not if it´s an antidote which works for two days or a week. Then it would be possible that Shinichi and Shiho would be working together (for the very first time, both in their old bodys) in a case concering the BO or something else. But i sure would like to see such a case! Maybe their behaviour do change (a bit at least?) when they are back to their old bodys, why not?

[Girl19]

@Girl 19 and melissa

I gonna quote Abs.:

Hate to intrude on this fantastic multi-way vitriol/misunderstanding fest, but...

So.....
Erm, may i interrupt your nice discussion without your sharp tongues ripping me apart? Thanks in advance.

I dunno about this stuff if Gosho intended to bring Ai up in the story not only as *link* and *ally* but also as *triangle love whatever thing*, but now we have alot of Aicon fans and more fans who likes Ranichi. So who cares about why the editors really wanted to not take Ai into vol 10 but 18 and goes for Heiji and then created Kazuha to avoid Yaoi-stuff (they fail´d btw)?
I understand both of your argumtations, both are logical and comprehensible but they get us nowhere right now (-my feeling, can be wrong ), so do me a favour and stop giving me worries cause i have a feeling i´m watching a bich-i mean a firm discussion with no *winner*. be nice to each other and use a smiley more often.

LOL *gives James some cookies*
Yeah I'll try to sound more friendly and use more smilies. ^^
I didn't mean to sound bitchy, so sorry if I did or if I offended anyone.

----------

This is just how you want to see it.

Well I did say it was MY opinion, after all.
However, I'm sure I'm not the only one who sees that...

I think for the majority of the readers consider Ai as a link to the BO and another ally for Conan who knows about his true idendity.
If he wanted a love triangle.... he would have created a link between Shiho and Shinichi - a meeting in the past, a shared memory, anything. But he never did that.

Not really.. Creating a meeting in the past has nothing to do with the love triangle thing. For instance, Aoyama did create a past meeting with Vermouth, yet he didn't make "Ran-Shinichi-Vermouth" a love triangle.

The "cute moments" that some people like to interpret as "love" is a result from Ais respect for Conan, the guilt she feels, Conans protectiveness for everyone and the fact that they can talk to each other without hiding their true identities.

This is just how you want to see it.
As for me, it's pretty obvious that Ai's respect and admiration towards Conan has changed into love since a long time ago.
Even Yukiko noticed that, so it's now something I take for granted.

If Gosho wants to include Conan in a love triangle he should have used Ayumi, not Ai. At least she declared her love for him (However serious you want to accept her declaration of a 7 year old).

I don't think we can compare AiCon to AyuCon (new word ^^) since I don't think a 7-year-old girl is capable of actually loving someone. The thing Ayumi has for Conan is not love, it's called a crush; just like what Mitsuhiko feels towards Ai and what Genta feels towards eel rice (jk ). Most of us had crushes when we were children, so it's understandable. But this is just my opinion.

[Girl19]

Otherwise... I can't remember a scene that "proves that Ai loves Conan".

How about when she smiled because Conan couldn't tell Ran his feelings?
What about when she was thinking "You still don't get anything." (episode 340)?

If I remember correctly it was another one of these joke scenes. Didn't she say before that she was 80 years old? Sure, we know that this is PROBABLY not her real age (you never know 100% sure, see Vermouth  :P) and when she said it it was meant to confuse Conan, not to "hint her interest in him".
Or maybe it was a hint to show little Conan actually knows about her.

I don't understand why people still don't want to admit that Haibara really is the age she says.
We did see her when she got her adult body back; she was young. So 18 or even a little bit older in her age range.
The "I'm 80/84" thing was just a joke, of course.

[Schillok]

Nah, not if it´s an antidote which works for two days or a week. Then it would be possible that Shinichi and Shiho would be working together (for the very first time, both in their old bodys) in a case concering the BO or something else. But i sure would like to see such a case! Maybe their behaviour do change (a bit at least?) when they are back to their old bodys, why not?

Yay, fanfiction. 
No, seriously this sounds exactly like fanfiction. I love fanfiction (even though the scenario you described would probably not interest me much), but we should all keep in mind that it just reflects the ideas and preferences of the autor and is often not consistent with the cannon.
If that case really happens - and their behaviour towards each other really changed - then Ai x Conan become a cannon pairing like Satô x Takagi.
But until then it is just a fanpairing, something like Sonoko x Heiji (just with a slightly higher number of supporters  ).

This is just how you want to see it.
As for me, it's pretty obvious that Ai's respect and admiration towards Conan has changed into love since a long time ago.

Well, as long as you remember that there is another interpretation it is okay. I can't stand reading "Ai x Conan is FACT" when it is merely an one-sided view on some scenes.

Not really.. Creating a meeting in the past has nothing to do with the love triangle thing. For instance, Aoyama did create a past meeting with Vermouth, yet he didn't make "Ran-Shinichi-Vermouth" a love triangle.

Well, but it helped to emphasize the relationship of Vermouth with those two, didn't it? It explains why she behaves towards them the way she does.
Ai on the other hand is "The scientist who ruined Shinichis live". Which explains a lot of her behaviour towards Conan. A good motive for making her feel guilty, a bad one to explain falling in love.

[Abs.]

Otherwise... I can't remember a scene that "proves that Ai loves Conan".

How about when she smiled because Conan couldn't tell Ran his feelings?
What about when she was thinking "You still don't get anything." (episode 340)?

I could argue that every one of these scenes is evidence that Haibara/Shiho actually has a thing for Ran 

[Schillok]

Otherwise... I can't remember a scene that "proves that Ai loves Conan".

How about when she smiled because Conan couldn't tell Ran his feelings?
What about when she was thinking "You still don't get anything." (episode 340)?

Well... I can't remember the scene were she smiled because Conan couldn't tell Ran his feelings. What episode was that?
And in episode 340... you mean the scene after she feigned to be asleep when Ran brought her the egg porridge? When she couldn't face Ran because she reminds her too much of her sister? Especially at that moment when she thought about what she lost and isolated herself from others out of fear of the BO. Don't tell me you think she was envious of Ran because Conan loves her - she didn't look at him while thinking that, she was looking at the soup Ran prepared and started eating it when the melancholic music started?!
Well, that is not what I consider a "proof of her love for Conan". 

[Girl19]

But until then it is just a fanpairing, something like Sonoko x Heiji (just with a slightly higher number of supporters  ::) ).

The fact that AiCon has more supporters itself means that there is something more..
As for Sonoko, she never even showed interest towards Heiji; so I don't think it can be compared to AiCon.
Maybe SonokoXHeiji can be compared to AiXKaito. lol

Well, as long as you remember that there is another interpretation it is okay. I can't stand reading "Ai x Conan is FACT" when it is merely an one-sided view on some scenes.

Of course, AiCon as a love couple is not a fact; you're right.
But Ai having feelings for Conan and him not noticing them is.

Well, but it helped to emphasize the relationship of Vermouth with those two, didn't it? It explains why she behaves towards them the way she does.
Ai on the other hand is "The scientist who ruined Shinichis live". Which explains a lot of her behaviour towards Conan. A good motive for making her feel guilty, a bad one to explain falling in love.

You're right about both points. *nods*
However, Haibara shouldn't feel guilty since she didn't intentionally ruin his life. She was forced to make APTX4869.

Well... I can't remember the scene were she smiled because Conan couldn't tell Ran his feelings. What episode was that?
And in episode 340... you mean the scene after she feigned to be asleep when Ran brought her the egg porridge? When she couldn't face Ran because she reminds her too much of her sister? Especially at that moment when she thought about what she lost and isolated herself from others out of fear of the BO. Don't tell me you think she was envious of Ran because Conan loves her - she didn't look at him while thinking that, she was looking at the soup Ran prepared and started eating it when the melancholic music started?!
Well, that is not what I consider a "proof of her love for Conan".  

I don't think at that time she saw Akemi through Ran yet. I think she only started thinking of Ran in a sisterly way in episode 345 when she protected her/saved her life. I do think Haibara was a bit jealous of Ran in the beginning; more evidence can be found in episode 246.

And the scene where Haibara smiled was in the episode right after the Desperate Revival arc (episode 194 , I guess).

[mangaluva]

These posts are getting too long and argumentative again to bother arsing about with...

IMHO, Shiho has a thing for Shinichi but she'll never act on it because she likes Ran too much as a substitute sister.  Simples. *meerkat noise*

[Schillok]

The fact that AiCon has more supporters itself means that there is something more..
As for Sonoko, she never even showed interest towards Heiji; so I don't think it can be compared to AiCon.
Maybe SonokoXHeiji can be compared to AiXKaito. lol

The number of supporters doesn't mean much. There are more supporters of Shinichi x Kid than there are of Yukiko x Yusaku. Would you really sugggest Shinichi x Kid is more realistic than the (the existing) Yusaku x Yukiko?!? 

But Ai having feelings for Conan and him not noticing them is.

No. Unless you have a solid proof for "Ais feelings of love for Conan".
This what I am talking about You can believe in your fandom all the way you want, you can even try to convince others of it. But don't say "it is the truth" just because you believe in it.

I don't think at that time she saw Akemi through Ran yet. I think she only started thinking of Ran in a sisterly way in episode 345 when she protected her/saved her life. I do think Haibara was a bit jealous of Ran in the beginning; more evidence can be found in episode 246.

No, it started earlier that she saw the similarity between Ran and Akemi. I think it was during the case at the beach where she got a sun-stroke. Which is episode 246. It's not because of jealouslyw

I don't have a record of episode 194 and it is too long since I saq it on TV. I will try to find the chapter in the manga and see what you mean.

[AICHAN]

No. Unless you have a solid proof for "Ais feelings of love for Conan".
 

wow,i really want to know what is a solid proof?do you want to see haibara praising conan all the time? do you want to see ai blushing every time she talks to conan? it's not in her personality to show her feelings(althought she did blush a little sometimes--->the" there is something in my face"scene^^ and more recently,when ayumi thought something happened between conan and ai(vol 60))
do you want to see her saying to conan "i like you" or "i love you"?even in the canon pairigs,they don't admit it

haibara is a sublte girl,so her hidden feelings can't be that visible ,contrary to other girls,and the rare time she shows her feelings,it's very subtle,and can be ambigus sometimes(using metaphors...)
i wasn't a coai fan in the begining,but i saw the signs of her heelings for conan,so i don't think it's because we're coai fan that we assume haibara has feelings for conan....(for me it's the contrary)

[baka1412]

Don't mind me.. go on.. I love to read these kind of debate, though, i am not a debater my self..

So pardon me for my lack of involvement right now

[AICHAN]

Don't mind me.. go on.. I love to read these kind of debate, though, i am not a debater my self..

So pardon me for my lack of involvement right now

LOLXD we forgive you^^you're not the only one who doesn't want to debate... i usually don't like it too,except for the topic i like...

[Schillok]

Arghh... I just lost the text I was about to post... So, again.  :-[

wow,i really want to know what is a solid proof?do you want to see haibara praising conan all the time? do you want to see ai blushing every time she talks to conan? it's not in her personality to show her feelings(althought she did blush a little sometimes--->the" there is something in my face"scene^^ and more recently,when ayumi thought something happened between conan and ai(vol 60))
do you want to see her saying to conan "i like you" or "i love you"?even in the canon pairigs,they don't admit it

With "proof" I mean something like this:

Spoiler:

Okay, that one is a bit too obivious, even for me.

And this:

Spoiler:

Or this:

Spoiler:

Eww... mirrored and with horrible grammar. But I have no better copy...

Or maybe that:

Spoiler:

But this isn't something I consider evidence for a pairing (or one-sided love):

Spoiler:

Well, actually it is: But for Conan towards Ran.

Well, I think we can see: In cannon pairings, they admit it! Either by words (Ran) or by actions (Takagi and his ring), but in any way obvious enough so the readers notices it.

Sure Ai, I is very subtile and would probably not declare her love (for which person ever) easyly. But even though we - as the readers - are able to see/read Haibaras thoughts or watch her when she is alone never got a (solid) evidence of her feeling "love" (in the meaning of romantic love) for anyone.

I think it is save to say Conan x Ai is no cannon pairing. The "hints" are not unambiguous enough, there is no proof.
That doesn't mean that there might not be solid evidence in a future chapter. Or that you can support this fandom if you like it. But don't pretend it is already there and that others just "refuse to see Haibaras obvious love for Conan".  

[Conia]

too...
much...
REAL...
discussion...
in...
Ai+Conan...
thread...

Conia dizzy