Mafia Round 19: Shake Up Christmas

[Detective Tommy]

Sorry. D:
So should I change the phase change?
I find it unfair to change the phase time for Dus, while it puts you at an inconvenience.

*continues to wait for changes criticisms*

[Abs.]

I'm still in PT.

*tries not to write anything perverted in response*

Making too many exceptions to random rules is bad, imo.

^ This

[Vylash]

I'm still in PT.

*tries not to write anything perverted in response*

shhhhhhhh, don't ruin the moment

[Edogawa4869]

[Schillok]

Time:
I don't care. It's not like its that important anyway. Not to play because the phase change is while you are sleeping... I think it is just a weak excuse.
No, rather it will make players start with their discussions, accusations, etc. earlier, and not wait until the last hour to finally send their orders in. Yeah, it can be useful to be online during the phase change to quickly react to developments, but... as it was said: We have players all around the world so someone is bound to be at a disadvantage. On the other hand we also have GMs from all around the world so if the time is bad for you this game it might be perfect during the round of another GM.

No, the GM should decide for himself when it is most convenient for himself - because (s)he needs to do a lot of work and will need some time for preparation and answering the players order. The time should be in the way it fits the GM best. Don't try to please every player. It won't work anyway.



So let's come to the good part, the changes:  ;D

Changes
- Investigate Player X killed Player Y will be changed to PlayerX attacked Player Y. Therefore, attacks/killing can be easier to find. Attempted murder can be arrested for. If killing is discombobulated, then the attack didn't happen therefore the investigation would be false.

I think "killing" and "attacking" should also be treated the same. I still want to write my investigations as "Investigate Kleene killing Abs." if I want to.

- If Kogoro gets his alcohol stolen, he becomes sober. Also, after the 6th town death, he gets sober.

Stealing is fine with me I guess. He will have a hard time when his alcohol gets stolen anyway... no matter which thief did it.

- Police, FBI and Ayumi will get handcuffs added to stolen items.

Don't like it. More "garbage" to steal for the BO when they already know that a certain player is police, but not which role. Trying to differentiate between Yumi and Satô is bad enough already. Having to waste another night because handcuffs got stolen makes things even worse.
Also, Ayumi shouldn't have them. They were an one-time occurrence during that movie. Kogoro also had some during his time as police. Even Kazuha and Heiji should have handcuffs according to that logic.
Finally... Kid stealing handcuffs knows it is an ally. But also that it is likely a police - the role that he should avoid contacting. Does Kid really need to become stronger? Do we really want him to contact police that quickly?

Change in current roles abilities
- Korn will get reverse betrayal. But I don't think Vodka should get betrayal. Maybe a different new ability.

Fine with me. Korn needed it more. Vodka might be a bit weaker than most other BO, but is still good. And can be great in certain situations.

-

If Nakamori uses pinch face on a disguised player, the disguiser is automatically arrested.
- I might make Pinch-Face night OR day action. So, once per phase. Why should it only be at night? Hmmm, but Kid does only steal at night

Again, I agree. Once per phase should make the life of the disguisers a bit easier. And still allow the ability to be useful to do something when used right.

- Whenever  Jirokichi gem is stolen from, he will get in contact with Nakamori first. If Nakamori is not in the game, he will contact a random police. Once he contacts one police, he will not contact a different police when his gem is stolen again.

What happens if the police Jirokichi is in contact with gets killed?

- If Ai is in the game, there will only be 2 BO that have no scent in the game.

Anokata and Akemi are the only BO without scent anyway, right? I mean, unless we allow a time-paradoxon by removing the rule that Sherry and Ai can't both be in the game.

- For Akai, If he get's attacked at night, Akai dies but will also injure his attacker (whether it's BO or not). If he get's lynched, the person he votes for dies. Also, since APTXing him would hinder his vengeance, maybe vengeance still goes through in case Akai get's lynched? Tho that's not necessary if the change described above is included

Can an injured BO still kill? Because if not that would require some adjustments to the killing orders, or the BO will end in a situation where the only one who is allowed to kill is the injured BO who can not kill. Also, I don't think I like that if the injured player is the only BO remaining he would have to give up since he could not win the game, even if only 1 townie were remaining.


New Roles

*Criminals*

Spoiler: Numabuchi Kichiro, Paranoid Ex-Lab-rat

Numabuchi Kichiro, Paranoid Ex-Lab-rat
Status: Paranoid
Night Action: Murder
Night Action: Stake-Out (Automatic)
Interrogation: Not BO?
Scent: No
Disguise: No
Items: Alcohol
Observe: Adult

Status: Paranoid
- Due to his paranoia, Numabuchi automatically stakes himself out. This can be investigated just as any normal stake-out.
- If Numabuchi goes two nights in a row without killing someone, his paranoia gets the best of him and he commits suicide that night.

Night Action: Murder
- During any night phase, Numabuchi may choose to not kill someone.


Winning condition:
Numabuchi wins if he is alive (and not arrested) at the end of the game, no matter which side has won. (He manged to hide himself from the BO and could flee, no matter which side won the conflict).

- I think he is good the way he is. Wants to be alive (and free) at the end of the conflict and has no scruples to kill. Dangerous to town and BO, so both sides might consider leaving him around once they find him.

There are some discussions about him ongoing. Especially how he should win. Look in the rules and roles threat! And voice you opinion, everyone!
Also, I think it was suggested that he should be "not BO".

Spoiler: Natsuki Koshizumi, bloodthirsty Teenage Detective of Southern Japan

Natsuki Koshizumi, bloodthirsty Teenage Detective of Southern Japan            
Night action: (Investigate1 and Special Investigate 1) OR Interrogate            
Night Action: Murder          
Prep. Action: Hitlist            
Interrogation: Not BO            
Scent: No            
Disguise: No            
Items: Panties, head gear, gun            
Observe: Teenager            
           
Hitlist:            
-During prep phase, you have to send the GM a list of five other players (no, you can't put your own name on the hitlist)            
- In the nights 2 - 5, four of them will be killed, you can decide which one to kill for each night            
- Your kills will follow the same rules as a kill supported with bribe, meaning they can't be hindered in any way            
- The killing will continue even if you die before the end of night 5.            
- You have to kill 4 people, but you can add a new name to the list if only three people are still alive            
- APTX (Sherry) > Your kill > BO's kill: This means if the BO and you both decide to kill the same person during the night, the BO will fail their kill. If Sherry APTXs someone however, you fail and have to kill someone else instead later on            
           
           
Winning conditions:            
Usual conditions for a town role, but looses if you're arrested or lynched.


- The town-friendly criminal who will do her best to get rid of the BO as quickly as possible.

Again, there are concerns about her victory condition being too hard to fulfill (compared  to normal townies). Though, my opinion was differently, so again the input of everyone on what to do with her would be useful.

Spoiler: Bomber

Bomber

Night Action: Murder
Night Action:
Interrogation: Not BO
Scent: No
Disguise: No
Items: Alcohol, Car-Keys
Observe: Adult

Winning condition:
The bomber wins if all police are dead and he is still alive and not arrested.


Notes:
- The police-hating bomber from the Matsuda case. Obviously he is very useful for the BO and the town should try to get rid of him quickly once they know he is around.
- I think he needs an ability. But which? Blame maybe (he wanted to blame the police for not stopping him)? Also some kind of ability that allows him to

Does anyone know his name? The bomber that set the bombs in Tokio Tower, trapping Takagi and Conan - as well as in Teitan High School.

Spoiler: Vengeful Killer

Vengeful Killer

Night action: Steal          
Night Action: Murder                    
Interrogation: Not BO            
Scent: No            
Disguise: No            
Items: Alcohol, Glasses, Headgear, Car-Keys            
Observe: Adult            

During night 1 he will gain a role that he wishes to kill. If his target gets killed in any other way (lynched, APTX, by BO) they get a new target.

Winning condition:
The Vengeful Killer wins when he killed his target. He will lose if the game ended without doing so.


Note:
- His target could be BO or town.
- He will want to draw out the game if possible and find his target. He does not care which side wins afterwards, as long as he got his revenge.

Again, does anyone have a good example for a criminal that killed people to get revenge on someone (yeah, I know: Most criminals did. But some remarkable would be nice.)
Also, this person/culprit should have stolen to achieve that goal.

Questions:
- I'm debating whether to give the bomber blame. Two people being blamed a night, might not be so good IMO.

Not sure either. There might not be an Anokata in the game though. Having both should be rare. In which case it should still be fine since BO and the bomber should not work together. At least not initially.
Also, it was suggested to give him observe. To blend in a tiny bit better. And have more chances finding police (adults). Though, this might make him turn against the BO more than intended as well. (Considering he is otherwise helpful to the BO this might be fine...)

- Can the bomber kill Akai, Camel and Conan? I kind of want to make them exceptions because they escaped bombs in the story. XDD

Well, and so did most of the rest of cast at some point in time. Especially Takagi. Poor Tequila is the exception, of course.  ::)

- If Ai and Sherry are not both in the game, who can we add that will have "follow"?

I agree with Akonly: No need for another role with that ability.

Notes:
- The vengeful killer is getting steal because he needs to find his target.

Now we just need a real name for him...

- Bomber will not know how many police are left. Once the bomber kills all the police, he will be PM'd.

Would have suggested the same.

- I don't like having DB possible lovers. If they are lovers, they can only be lovers with other DB, Haibara or Conan. I'm against Kids + Adults. So should I make them possibility for lovers? Or make there be 2 DB?

In that case: Just make the rule that "Kids can not be lovers." As long as all kids are treated equally I am fine. I just disliked allowing it for some, but forbidding it for others.

Also: Does that mean you will make it possible for only 1 DB starting the game (not at least 2 like before)?




TBC, with Tome and the other suggestions.

[Schillok]

Also, I would like to add Officer Tome into the game.
His ability could be like "Gather Evidence" and each night, the killer will lose an item and Tome will find it.
But if we do in fact do this, I say Tome cannot arrest. Please discuss.

"Gather evidence" would not be very useful. Most of the time there would be alcohol or a gun be left behind which... yeah, don't tell anything. Also, it could mess with KID in an unintended way...
And I would prefer to allow ALL police to arrest. This is what ties them together, what they all have in common. No reason to make Tome an exception, especially considering that traffic warden Yumi is allowed to arrest as well.

As for Tome:
my idea for officer tome was just an officer with special investigate rather than investigate, + arrest. Special investigate would be changed to past actions only, and James/Kir would gain "Special Investigate 1 OR Investigate 1" instead of just special investigate.

I think I would prefer that too. Of course only if you allow looking for disguising during the preparation phase" since Tome would be really really bored during night 1 otherwise...
Or... something else for night 1.

2. If the disguiser gets out of jail, then they will get a new disguise. Also, I'm thinking people can't be arrested twice for the same crime. Similar to the amendment that states you can't be charged with the same crime twice. Well, I live in the US. Not sure if that's the same in other countries. o.o;

Why so complicated?
- A player freed from being arrested with lawsuit can not be arrested for exactly the same crime again.

Done. No need for a new disguise. The released player can not be arrested for it a second time. No matter how often Nakamori face-pinches him.
Same if Eisuke was arrested for discombobulating Abs - and keeps discombobulating Abs. He can't be arrested for it again. However, as soon as he changes his target, he can get arrested for that new target then.

[Kleene Onigiri]

@time:

I basically don't care about the time too
But 4:30 am is a "uncomfortable" time. Because it's too late to stay awake till then. And it is also too early to wake up :V

Also, even if the Europeans would be asleep by then, it won't hinder other people to start accusing someone that already went to sleep :V But that problem was always there so meh :V

Still, I think moving it to 3:30 would be much better. Since the time you're asleep will get reduced :x

Also, need to go to sleep now too :V I'll comment on the new post tomorrow

[Akemi~chan]

is the magic kaitou cast included in here too? *likes akako alot*

[Abs.]

People are getting too wrapped up in the "sexual relations" version of the word lovers.  I say keep Conan and Haibara lover-capable, so that you may never be able to fully trust a child when you find one.  Otherwise we may as well start introducing rules such as "Ran and Kogoro/Eri can't be lovers" "Shinichi and Yukiko/Yusaku can't be lovers" etc.

[Schillok]

People are getting too wrapped up in the "sexual relations" version of the word lovers.  I say keep Conan and Haibara lover-capable, so that you may never be able to fully trust a child when you find one.  Otherwise we may as well start introducing rules such as "Ran and Kogoro/Eri can't be lovers" "Shinichi and Yukiko/Yusaku can't be lovers" etc.

Either allow all children as possible lovers - or none. Otherwise you would do exactly what you described here: Making exceptions for pairings simply because they are... controversial.

[Abs.]

Unless the "Lone DB" rule was already invoked, the reason why DBs can't be lovers is because they are already in a group.

Let me know how it works when you're BO and you have a 4 pax-strong town alliance at the beginning to face off with.

[Akonyl]

Either allow all children as possible lovers - or none. Otherwise you would do exactly what you described here: Making exceptions for pairings simply because they are... controversial.

As Abs said, the children not being able to be lovers has never been an issue of it being "controversial", it's because they're in a group already. Sonoko can't be a lover either, and that's certainly not because it's "controversial".

I see no reason to include the lone DB rule, because they're the Detective Boys, and their purpose is partly that they're in a group. It may be an unfortunate side-effect that they can't be lovers because of this, but really it's not a big deal at all unless you're dying to see a DB paired up with someone.

[Detective Tommy]

@Schillok,
1. Killing and attacking will be treated the same.
2. I see your point in handcuffs being extra baggage. It doesn't really add much. So no handcuffs.
3. If the police Jirokichi is in contact with dies, then he can contact someone new ONCE his gem that was given out, or his own gems are stolen.
4. Kleene and Akonyl already pointed out that the rule of maximum of 2 BO with no scents in the game was stupid. So I removed it XDD
5. The adjustment to injured BO, could be that they're injured for 2 phases. Similar to when police are arrested?
6. Numbabuchi was decided as town IIRC. And I think he should win once he kills all citizens. (Not BO, Not Police, Not FBI) But that might not be good depending on the amount of players.
7. I'm trying to figure out the bombers name right now.
8. But the bomber isn't on the BO's side. Is he? He wasn't in the anime.
9. I might just make kids lovers even though I'm uncomfortable with this idea. Because I can't find a way to make it equal except just not making them lovers, and bringing back DB groups.
10. So Yukiko cannot get a new disguise when she gets freed? I'm fine with that.

*still searching for bombers name*

[Detective Tommy]

Either allow all children as possible lovers - or none. Otherwise you would do exactly what you described here: Making exceptions for pairings simply because they are... controversial.

As Abs said, the children not being able to be lovers has never been an issue of it being "controversial", it's because they're in a group already. Sonoko can't be a lover either, and that's certainly not because it's "controversial".

I see no reason to include the lone DB rule, because they're the Detective Boys, and their purpose is partly that they're in a group. It may be an unfortunate side-effect that they can't be lovers because of this, but really it's not a big deal at all unless you're dying to see a DB paired up with someone.

I'm thinking about keeping them as groups. But should we give them another ability? Or no?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qWAdQ5w ... re=related
The bomber's name isn't mentioned at all. So should we just call him crazed bomber? That's what wiki called him. XDD

[KainTheVampire]

*joins*