Mafia Round 12 - Bear Round! (Day Five...??)

[Callid]

Ooops, I didn't notice Gin could Investigate. Oh ****. OK, anyway, he needed to have already decided to investigate me. Which does make sense if he were a distrustful police officer, but makes less sense if he were Vermouth in disguise and probably had a few things more going on than randomly investigating some action I might take. But, of course, I didn't take Gin into account - although probably slandering is still more effective than investigating - or at least it seemed like this last time I played - and what I said about Vermouth is true here as well. But of course, it might be true. Also, pay attention to the last paragraph of my second - no, third - post.

[Akonyl]

Ooops, I didn't notice Gin could Investigate. Oh ****. OK, anyway, he needed to have already decided to investigate me. Which does make sense if he were a distrustful police officer, but makes less sense if he were Vermouth in disguise and probably had a few things more going on than randomly investigating some action I might take. But, of course, I didn't take Gin into account - although probably slandering is still more effective than investigating - or at least it seemed like this last time I played - and what I said about Vermouth is true here as well. But of course, it might be true. Also, pay attention to the last paragraph of my second - no, third - post.

what about it? That you don't understand why he didn't reply to your PM yet? I'm not sure I see the significance, all I can draw from that is a "he looks suspicious" card, which seems weird since the rest of your posts are defending him, so I'm not sure I get your point there.

[pofa]

Ooops, I didn't notice Gin could Investigate. Oh ****. OK, anyway, he needed to have already decided to investigate me. Which does make sense if he were a distrustful police officer, but makes less sense if he were Vermouth in disguise and probably had a few things more going on than randomly investigating some action I might take. But, of course, I didn't take Gin into account - although probably slandering is still more effective than investigating - or at least it seemed like this last time I played - and what I said about Vermouth is true here as well. But of course, it might be true. Also, pay attention to the last paragraph of my second - no, third - post.

Actually, it's not uncommon for Gin (and Vermouth, if she can) to prove to a couple of townies that he can investigate the first night (before the black suitcase comes into play). But again, it's not conclusive.

[Callid]

And as pofa said, you may not even be the police yourself, and could maybe get a vermouth to do it for you. Because it's the day phase right now, nobody can investigate if it's actually you doing it, and during the night you could black suitcase it, with vermouth doing the arrest for the in-thread effect.

So you just want us to abstain? Even if the BO doesn't vote for you, it'll probably be another townie that "randomly" dies.

Do you mean me with "you" or is this the "general you"? Or did you confuse me with Schillok? Cause I didn't even claim that I'm police until now, so I wonder how you got that impression.

Ooops, I didn't notice Gin could Investigate. Oh ****. OK, anyway, he needed to have already decided to investigate me. Which does make sense if he were a distrustful police officer, but makes less sense if he were Vermouth in disguise and probably had a few things more going on than randomly investigating some action I might take. But, of course, I didn't take Gin into account - although probably slandering is still more effective than investigating - or at least it seemed like this last time I played - and what I said about Vermouth is true here as well. But of course, it might be true. Also, pay attention to the last paragraph of my second - no, third - post.

what about it? That you don't understand why he didn't reply to your PM yet? I'm not sure I see the significance, all I can draw from that is a "he looks suspicious" card, which seems weird since the rest of your posts are defending him, so I'm not sure I get your point there.

I want to tell you everything I know. My point isn't that "I know for sure that Schillok is innocent, and there's no doubt of it", but "I have a lot of evidence that points to him being innocent, but there are a few things I wonder about as well, but which are much less important than the other, more concrete evidence".

Actually, it's not uncommon for Gin (and Vermouth, if she can) to prove to a couple of townies that he can investigate the first night (before the black suitcase comes into play). But again, it's not conclusive.

The point is that Schillok didn't know I would investigate him because he was asleep. The only reason he might have decided to investigate me to begin with was to gather information on me - yet I consider slandering much strongly, not to mention that his investigation was very, very likely to fail.

Also, as a side note, it might be he didn't mention me cause he didn't investigate if I investigated him and he instead investigated if I killed someone and so he failed to make the connection between my message and his action. Although this still doesn't explain why he didn't even bother to answer my PM.

[Akonyl]

And as pofa said, you may not even be the police yourself, and could maybe get a vermouth to do it for you. Because it's the day phase right now, nobody can investigate if it's actually you doing it, and during the night you could black suitcase it, with vermouth doing the arrest for the in-thread effect.

So you just want us to abstain? Even if the BO doesn't vote for you, it'll probably be another townie that "randomly" dies.

Do you mean me with "you" or is this the "general you"? Or did you confuse me with Schillok? Cause I didn't even claim that I'm police until now, so I wonder how you got that impression.

sorry, first part was directed at schillok, second part was directed at you and somewhat him.

I want to tell you everything I know. My point isn't that "I know for sure that Schillok is innocent, and there's no doubt of it", but "I have a lot of evidence that points to him being innocent, but there are a few things I wonder about as well, but which are much less important than the other, more concrete evidence".

ah, fair enough.

Actually, it's not uncommon for Gin (and Vermouth, if she can) to prove to a couple of townies that he can investigate the first night (before the black suitcase comes into play). But again, it's not conclusive.

The point is that Schillok didn't know I would investigate him because he was asleep. The only reason he might have decided to investigate me to begin with was to gather information on me - yet I consider slandering much strongly, not to mention that his investigation was very, very likely to fail.

Also, as a side note, it might be he didn't mention me cause he didn't investigate if I investigated him and he instead investigated if I killed someone and so he failed to make the connection between my message and his action. Although this still doesn't explain why he didn't even bother to answer my PM.

ah, I get what you're saying now. Though, this then hinges on us believing you're not just an accomplice, which is a little harder to disprove in a "we're both town" situation than a "he's totally BO, lynch him" scenario.

[Kleene Onigiri]

DUN DUN


I for once didn't investigate Schillok on the last night, but on Night 1 (where there is no Black suitcase) and got a true on his investigation ability.
So, he can for sure do investigations as his own ability.

But he could still be Gin or Vermouth. But on the other hand, he wouldn't say that he can arrest someone then. Since you can't fake arresting in any way with a black suitcase.
Only thing that can happen is that Schillok is Gin. And Vermouth is doing the arresting as a police officer. Or Vermouth as a police officer.
Still, two BO roles that can be easily checked imo.

But I think Schillok is actually town and could die on night 3 because of revealing his role D:

[James Rye]

Schillok is auch deutscher? Jesus, wie viele sind ma denn hier?

If Schillok will make a arrest to prove that he´s townie, i won´t vote for him and wait for the result. Of cource he/she could be BO and let Vermouth do a arrest if she´s a police or Schillok is himself/herself Vermouth. But then if we have Ai we can check that possibility.
Also he/she took a risk, letting everyone know that he/she´s police. The BO can try to narrow it down now who she/he is though that could take some time, maybe.

I´ll vote for someone who hasn´t posted much yet, just to be sure for this random voting methode.

[Akonyl]

I for once didn't investigate Schillok on the last night, but on Night 1 (where there is no Black suitcase) and got a true on his investigation ability.
So, he can for sure do investigations as his own ability.

And what did you just happen to investigate him doing, investigating you?

I mean, I'm willing to believe one person getting a coincidental "true" on night 1, but forgive me if I'm a little skeptical of two people getting coincidental "trues" on the same person on night 1.

And even if Schillok is Gin, how is vermouth easily checkable? It could be anyone, and you'd have to guess what police role they were disguised as also.

And if people really don't want to vote Schillok, then alright but I'm voting for someone either way.

[Schillok]

I'm not sure what to do today. I find Schillok suspicious for basically the same reasons PhoenixTears does, along with the fact that xpon voted for him yesterday (they might have told him to vote a BO member). But as Schillok and PhoenixTears both already said, none of that is in any way conclusive; it's just suspicion.

The problem with the arrest attempt is that if this round works like the last couple of rounds, we won't know for sure if Schillok was the one who made the attempt. We'll just know that an arrest attempt was made by a police officer. And if there's a Vermouth in the game disguised as a police officer, the BO can just have her make the arrest attempt and Schillok can pretend he did it. It's also possible Schillok himself is Vermouth.

So basically if I were BO, I could only be Gin or Vermouth (disguised as an police officer) since I already investigated during night 1 - and Abs. and the third ally know that.
For that scenario to work Vermouth would have to be disguised as police. Possible, sure. But she could also be (almost) any other role, the scenario described only works under that specific condition. Beside - checking me disguising for the remaining 4 police roles to see if I am Vermouth shouldn't be a problem. Or interrogating me to see if I am Gin (and maybe check if I slander myself just to make sure).
[/quote]

On the other hand, if we lynch him and he's town, we'll have five dead townies and one less police officer. And we'll feel all bad. So I don't know if we should lynch him or not.

Don't lynch me. I had to go so far and tell everyone I am police already. And I am going to prove it. As a town voting for me does make much less sense than voting for any other (random) player. I am already in everyones attention now. As I said, I could only be Gin or Vermouth, both which can be found out easily.

The other thing is, the dream I had last night points to a couple of possible BO suspects. But I got a possible "true" result from someone besides those suspects (of course, this person could be BO, too. Or misinterpreting the hints. They weren't really cut-and-dry -_-). So lynching one of them, at least right now, wouldn't really be conclusive either. And introducing more lynch suspects today would give the BO a better chance to blend in or get a tie. I'm open to advice about that, though.

So you would rather lynch me, despite trying to prove I am town instead one of those suspects from your dream? Beside... isn't a tie in this situation something that would be beneficial to the town? It gives us another night to prove the innocence (or guilt) of more players.

If we decide not to lynch Schillok today, and there's an Ai in the game, it might be worthwhile to follow him to see if he's Vermouth. And if there are DBs, they might want to see if he's Anokata.

Sounds good to me. Though, if there is Haibara in the game she would waste her follow ability if I were lynched. So don't vote for me.

And as pofa said, you may not even be the police yourself, and could maybe get a vermouth to do it for you. Because it's the day phase right now, nobody can investigate if it's actually you doing it, and during the night you could black suitcase it, with vermouth doing the arrest for the in-thread effect.

But then the real Vermouth would not be able to investigate for 2 phases. And if she is already in an alliance right now her victims could notice that she can't investigate any more.
Beside, as I said: This is all under the assumption that Vermouth is really disguised as an police officer.

[Callid]

And as pofa said, you may not even be the police yourself, and could maybe get a vermouth to do it for you. Because it's the day phase right now, nobody can investigate if it's actually you doing it, and during the night you could black suitcase it, with vermouth doing the arrest for the in-thread effect.

So you just want us to abstain? Even if the BO doesn't vote for you, it'll probably be another townie that "randomly" dies.

Do you mean me with "you" or is this the "general you"? Or did you confuse me with Schillok? Cause I didn't even claim that I'm police until now, so I wonder how you got that impression.

sorry, first part was directed at schillok, second part was directed at you and somewhat him.

Although even then, as I pointed out above, BS is unlikely.

Also, of course, I can't prove that I'm town either, except via investigating. You can freely interrogate me, though we haven't found a dead Gin yet, or follow me as well; but apart from that, I can't do anything, except arresting someone for something, but I don't even have clues, so yeah...

As far as suspecting someone is concerned, TheBlind is on top of my list. However, I don't have any concrete evidence, it's just three things that bugs me:
a) His constant quoting of songs and poems. It feels as if he don't want to speak on his own, cause it might give something away.
b) He asked for more risk on Night 1. That's exactly what the BO wants!
c) He also claimed Khinkun had told him "something about" unicorns. He didn't specify how he said that, which is VERY strange IMO, and not to mention that the whole unicorn thing was a joke on Akonyl's behalf.

Nonetheless, I have no solid evidence (and probably won't get any soon), I can only tell he didn't kill Schillok on Night 1. Duh. So, if you have any stronger reason to suspect someone, bring it forward! TheBlind is, even IMO, only a last option!

I mean, I'm willing to believe one person getting a coincidental "true" on night 1, but forgive me if I'm a little skeptical of two people getting coincidental "trues" on the same person on night 1.

I did it on Night 2, not Night 1.

[TheBlind]

Yeah, I skimmed everything that was said and I say we trust the Abs. man.
We lynch Schillok. Then we lynch Callid/Akonyl. Then we lynch nomemory. Problem solved.

[Akonyl]

I mean, I'm willing to believe one person getting a coincidental "true" on night 1, but forgive me if I'm a little skeptical of two people getting coincidental "trues" on the same person on night 1.

I did it on Night 2, not Night 1.

Ah, I thought you did it on Night 1, and were using it as an argument against him using the suitcase, but rereading it I see it now.

Though, I'm still not sure where that leaves us then.

[Tanner-kun]

Yeah, I skimmed everything that was said and I say we trust the Abs. man.
We lynch Schillok. Then we lynch Callid/Akonyl. Then we lynch nomemory. Problem solved.

Could you tell me your bases for wanting to kill Callid, Akonyl, and Nomemory? and maybe you would want to defend yourself against the people that are accusing you.

[Callid]

Yeah, I skimmed everything that was said and I say we trust the Abs. man.
We lynch Schillok. Then we lynch Callid/Akonyl. Then we lynch nomemory. Problem solved.

Are you trying to make yourself supicious!? I don't get it, really. I just said you act strange, and suggested you for lynching, and what do you do? Make an idiotic suggestion?
Now I'm really convinced about lynching you, even without solid evidence.

Yeah, I skimmed everything that was said and I say we trust the Abs. man.
We lynch Schillok. Then we lynch Callid/Akonyl. Then we lynch nomemory. Problem solved.

Could you tell me your bases for wanting to kill Callid, Akonyl, and Nomemory? and maybe you would want to defend yourself against the people that are accusing you.

Exactly my point. Duh.

[Akonyl]

Yeah, I skimmed everything that was said and I say we trust the Abs. man.
We lynch Schillok. Then we lynch Callid/Akonyl. Then we lynch nomemory. Problem solved.

Could you tell me your bases for wanting to kill Callid, Akonyl, and Nomemory? and maybe you would want to defend yourself against the people that are accusing you.

Exactly my point. Duh.

I dunno about nomemory, but I would say he's jealous of neither of us having died yet.